Frustrated FiOS Subscriber’s Video Exposes Severity of Verizon's Netflix Throttling

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John Pombrio

I have an XBox One and an XBox 360. Both of them do extremely well in streaming Netflix, even better than my computers and my HTPC. I wonder if XBox Gold gets around any semi-throttling by Cox? I have never seen any throttling with Cox BTW, I am just surprised how good Netflix looks with the XBoxes, YouTube as well.

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erriwin

Slightly (wayyyy) off topic, but its damn near impossible to have a conversation on RT. I was reading my news when all the sudden *boy that name and face sure looks familar...*
John Pombrio: "Do you know that RT and Channel One TV are being quoted at a bunch of web sites and on US and Europe television stations for the absurd conspiracy theories and misinformation that is being published as facts? So the plane was full of dead bodies? But was shot down by Ukrainian Forces? But was mistaken for Putin's flight? But needs to be more investigated? But the Donetsk Republic does not have any of the BUK missile platforms that people took pictures of in Eastern Ukraine? But the BUK missiles cannot fly that high? But This was really Malaysian Flight 370? But the plane was diverted to be shot down to start a war?"

I'm curious: what "absurd conspiracy theories and misinformation" are you speaking of exactly? I've been relying heavily on RT and thegaurdian and a few other foreign sources for my news for a while now; partly because they offer more worldly news than pretty much any domestic source, but mainly because in their actual news segments (not the opinion pieces) there seems to be far less bias in their journalism. I've always appreciated their facts on all sides being presented - but, perhaps I'm wrong... I'm not trying to be confrontational, just wondering what misinformation you believe RT is spreading? And all those questions you asked - I've not seen any info on any of those questions - where did they come from?

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Arthur Dent

I'm not surprised. Because everything is routed through Microsoft's servers, XB live basically functions like a VPN. Here in Australia it is even possible to access geoblocked services just by setting the location to US.

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Renegade Knight

That would explain the difference. The geoblocked access is a bonus.

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AFDozerman

Extremetech actually stated that the connection between L3 and Verizon consists of four gigabit cables hooked to two routers.

I take it that isn't standard practice for something of this scale?

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dgrmouse

AFDozerman asked, "I take it that isn't standard practice for something of this scale?"

I rather think it is. You can get more information by following the links to the l3 blog, but they are actually 10gb/s links housed in one of many designated co-location buildings.

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vrmlbasic

If so, how did Level 3 let this stand for so long? Perhaps Netflix ought to find a better middleman as this Level 3 organization doesn't seem to have a handle on things.

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dgrmouse

vrmlbasic asked, "how did Level 3 let this stand for so long?"

Instead of? They can't force Verizon to buy additional bandwidth. The best they could do is make the situation widely known and understood, and that's exactly what they did.

vrmlbasic said, "Perhaps Netflix ought to find a better middleman as this Level 3 organization doesn't seem to have a handle on things."

You're the one who doesn't have a handle on things. You can go to the carrier hotel and measure available bandwidth... on the Level3/Netflix side there is plenty to spare. The Verizon side, however, is severely congested. Why are you so averse to accepting this basic fact?

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Spiral01

Why has no one suggested the only real answer? Drop Verizon and go back to cable, done and done!
( Be sure to let Verizon know why your cancelling.)

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vrmlbasic

Too often, Cable = Comcast and Comcast as an ISP is horrible all around but it also had its recent issues with Netflix :(

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wolfing

Worst thing is that Verizon FiOS customers pay a lot more for their internet (because it's much faster, but not for Netflix watching it seems).

Many years ago movie studios also were the owners of the movie theaters, and Congress ruled it was anti-competitive. Well, if that was so I believe it's even more so when the same people who give you fast speed internet (and exclusively so) also give you TV, extreme conflict of interests here. Government should force them to separate the companies and give equal access for real competition.

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dgrmouse

Honestly, your comment is about the only one here that seems accurate. Verizon, Comcast, Time Warner, and most of the other ISPs have their own content delivery networks that they would rather see customers use. And, as a person stuck on /horrible/ Internet with no route for improvement on the horizon, I absolutely agree that Internet access should be regulated as a utility. It's absolutely a quality of life issue, and billions of dollars of US grant money are merely being used to line the coffers of the big players without producing qualitative results.

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Jacob Stanbery

One of the comments on that video show that when the user tried to watch it with his Verizon internet, it was severely throttled, and other videos played fine on YouTube. He made this for proof.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xOtVt8y0TwU&feature=youtu.be

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jason2393

Maybe it's his computer being unable to play a 4k video, whereas the other he played was 480p at most.

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Eoraptor

Which just proves that Verizon's "75 mbps" FiOS service can barely serve VHS quality video if it's coming from Netflix, but it's inked content deals with companies like the NFL sail through in full HD without a problem. I don't think it's the end user hardware because he's not measuring framerate displays, he's measuring raw throughput of data.

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vrmlbasic

Does this rule out that Netflix is actually throttling Verizon subscribers? The VPN would get around that too, no?

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dgrmouse

Level3, the backbone provider, has publicly stated that Verizon's connection to them in the carrier hotel is at capacity and that Verizon refuses to add more links. So, yeah... there is zero chance that the blame falls on Netflix. The blame falls on Verizon for selling 75mbps connections to a ton of customers but aggregating them through a tiny sieve.

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vrmlbasic

"The blame falls on Verizon for selling 75mbps connections to a ton of customers but aggregating them through a tiny sieve."

Verizon isn't doing that since the VPN boosts that FiOS user's speed.

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dgrmouse

You obviously have no idea what you're talking about.

The aggregation point under contention is the connection between Verizon and Level3. Level3 has publicly stated that Verizon is at capacity on this interconnect and has pleaded with the company to add more links - to the extent that they even offered to buy and install the necessary hardware themselves. The VPN this guy is using routes his connection through a different peering point, and from there onto the L3 network.

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Xenite

That makes absolutely no sense whatsoever, Netflix benefits in no way by throttling anyone. This is 100% the responsibility of Verizon.

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vrmlbasic

The video posted by this guy does not disprove Netflix and/or this Level 3 organization being responsible for this.

Why doesn't it make sense that Netflix and its associates could conspire against the ISPs in order to obtain a better deal from them by creating and harnessing public outrage?

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Renegade Knight

It doesn't make sense because Netflix annoying it's customers with crappy video quality, lag, and buffering only creates less customers and less income for Netflix.

Meanwhile Verizon can blame Netflix, then throttle which gives them more real capacity to add subscribers who in turn pay Verizon increasing it's income.

The experiment doesn't rule out Netflix, but Occams Razor, Logic, and the time proven adage "Follow the money" point the finger at Verizon.

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dgrmouse

vrmlbasic asked, "Why doesn't it make sense that Netflix and its associates could conspire against the ISPs in order to obtain a better deal from them by creating and harnessing public outrage?"

Umm... because Netflix isn't looking to "deal" with Verizon. They ink deals with backbone companies to make their content available. Verizon also inks deals with backbone companies to provide access to their customers. Netflix isn't to blame for Verizon's failure to reserve sufficient bandwidth for their users.