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 Post subject: Some Linux people are just a bunch of....
PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 6:59 am 
SON OF A GUN
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Arrogant pricks, just like those on the Windows side can be.

http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/b ... actor.html

I guess I am uneducated eh? I use both IE and Firefox... I run windows (without AV no less) and I happen to like Windows 7.

I know we don't have any of these kinds of asshats here but I just wanted to vent. People like this HURT Linux more than help.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 7:55 am 
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I realised he was an asshat when he claimed to know people who thought Windows ME was their best OS. No one claims ME as their favourite OS.

The arrogance that pervades that article is nauseating, though. I could barely stomach it. The fact that he ends his article with a suggestion to buy his book just makes it worse.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 8:00 am 
Monkey Fed [PC]
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Heh, things like that are a very good reason I don't read PC world.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 9:02 am 
SON OF A GUN
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Every time I "read" an article on their site, I have ended up blogging about it and basically nailing them to the wall for being asshats.

Nobody ever said the liked ME... even hardcore Windows guys (I are one) think it was a joke.

Kinda like Microsoft Bob. :)

But yeah, this is THE SINGLE biggest issue preventing proliferation of Linux. Arrogance.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 12:21 pm 
TravBv2.0
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I once knew someone who said they liked Windows ME, but I can't remember who they are. I think right after that statement, I banished them from my life completely. :lol:

Crash, you're absolutely right. There are a lot of Linux guys out there who are complete pricks. They're the Nick Burns' of the Linux community.

User: "Why can't I see my C\ drive?"

NB: "Because you haven't mounted in your /mnt directory! Do you need to press the keys for you too? *scoffs*"

It's truly sad because every time I've needed help with Linux or Solaris stuff, I've never gotten anything but friendly answers. LQ.org. Sysadmintalk.com, even the Linux/BSD sub-forum at [H] have all given great help. Not to mention here at our very own Alt-OS Abode. The douches are few and far between, but you know what they say about a bad apple ruining the entire bunch.

The author, while very Nick Burns-ish, does have somewhat of a point. I've known people to have been using XP for years and not know crap about some of the lesser-used, basic functions of the OS. I blame this mostly that PCs are becoming less of computers and more of Internet machines, but still. Most regular users use the internet, and office. And he's partially correct about Ubuntu too. It's easy to use, has most everything already built-in, but you will have to learn some things to get the full experience.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 12:32 pm 
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RTFM or GTFO!

:cry:


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 4:34 am 
Northwood
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-Lawless wrote:
RTFM or GTFO!

:cry:


Doesn't work that way. RTFM doesn't always work. I have taught some very intelligent people who still need that first explanation to be made by a person. Then they are able to go to the manual to dig out the finer points. Then again, sometimes you need to be able to point to an example and then ask "How do I make that happen?" when you may not know the correct name or term for what it is you want to happen. By ridiculing people who may not grasp things as quickly as you do, or using the same method as you, or for not knowing something you have already mastered, you are being a jerkoid. I happen to enjoy seeing the light click on in someones eyes when they grasp what I'm showing them but you do have to be flexible. One method may not work with a particular student while a different one works just fine. And gee golly whizz, sometimes you have to explain things more than once.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 9:05 pm 
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TheSimulatorGuy wrote:
-Lawless wrote:
RTFM or GTFO!

:cry:


Doesn't work that way. RTFM doesn't always work. I have taught some very intelligent people who still need that first explanation to be made by a person. Then they are able to go to the manual to dig out the finer points. Then again, sometimes you need to be able to point to an example and then ask "How do I make that happen?" when you may not know the correct name or term for what it is you want to happen. By ridiculing people who may not grasp things as quickly as you do, or using the same method as you, or for not knowing something you have already mastered, you are being a jerkoid. I happen to enjoy seeing the light click on in someones eyes when they grasp what I'm showing them but you do have to be flexible. One method may not work with a particular student while a different one works just fine. And gee golly whizz, sometimes you have to explain things more than once.


Agreed 100%


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 9:17 pm 
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uughh, I used to use linux only for about 4 or 5 years. Every single one of my machines ran some distro of Linux. So why does my current machine run Vista X64? well its simple, I once again found my love for PC gaming. Frankly I don't like the quake 2 engine enough, to stomach gaming on linux, and tux racer doesn't cut it. It is a shame, for everyday use, linux is my #1 choice. When, or if ever, we get better native gaming support in Linux, I will switch back in a heartbeat.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2009 6:11 pm 
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As a programmer in the UNIX world I realize this: the smart ones are the ones with too little time to boast about how good they are because they are helping beginners/novices and are improving their own selves.

I'm a BSD guy myself and have only heard of one such asshat...though, this one asshat is very good at what he does ;). Exception to every rule perhaps?


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 12:04 am 
TravBv2.0
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Sim Guy, well said. Everyone learns differently.

Vegan, I'm in the same boat. I love Linux. It's stable, easy to use (once you learn it a bit), and can do almost anything you want to do with it. However, I too have found a love for PC gaming (again). I'm far too lazy to reboot every time I want to play my favorite hot PC title (COD4 anyone?), so I often use virtual Machines to give me my Linux fix. I do most of my browsing and usual computering in a Debian Lenny VM, messing around with a CentOS 5.2 server VM (still working on BIND/Postfix stuff), and leaving XP Pro for games only!

If Wine or Crossover Office was better at handling new games, or these game makers started making Linux-compatable titles, I'd drop Windows in a heartbeat. My girlfriend? She'd be lost. She uses my computer and loves her Windows!


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 12:43 am 
Klamath
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that Linux guy wrote:
Sim Guy, well said. Everyone learns differently.

Vegan, I'm in the same boat. I love Linux. It's stable, easy to use (once you learn it a bit), and can do almost anything you want to do with it. However, I too have found a love for PC gaming (again). I'm far too lazy to reboot every time I want to play my favorite hot PC title (COD4 anyone?), so I often use virtual Machines to give me my Linux fix. I do most of my browsing and usual computering in a Debian Lenny VM, messing around with a CentOS 5.2 server VM (still working on BIND/Postfix stuff), and leaving XP Pro for games only!

If Wine or Crossover Office was better at handling new games, or these game makers started making Linux-compatable titles, I'd drop Windows in a heartbeat. My girlfriend? She'd be lost. She uses my computer and loves her Windows!



Yeah I did the wine/crossover thing for a while. The game I play the most is TF2 and the only way to get it to run without bunch of black blocks everywhere was to force it into DX8. Now why the hell would I build a $2000 gaming machine to play my games in DX8? SUUUCCKKKKSSS


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 12:54 am 
Northwood
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pcfxer wrote:
As a programmer in the UNIX world I realize this: the smart ones are the ones with too little time to boast about how good they are because they are helping beginners/novices and are improving their own selves.

I'm a BSD guy myself and have only heard of one such asshat...though, this one asshat is very good at what he does ;). Exception to every rule perhaps?


That's not unusual. Once you master something to the point it becomes intuitive it can be difficult to actually explain why you did it the way you did.

When I was first discovering the world of electronics and asking lots of questions one guy told me that one day it would be my turn to answer the questions and when that time comes to just answer the question. Not to make fun of someone just because they had to ask. Also, if you are actually in a teacher/instructor role, nothing will turn students away faster than making fun of them. Not knowing what you are talking about will do it too but that's a different discussion.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 4:07 am 
SON OF A GUN
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that Linux guy wrote:
The douches are few and far between, but you know what they say about a bad apple ruining the entire bunch.
The problem here is they have the loudest voice or the biggest podium to spew their shit from.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 4:11 am 
SON OF A GUN
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that Linux guy wrote:
I'm far too lazy to reboot every time I want to play my favorite hot PC title (COD4 anyone?), so I often use virtual Machines to give me my Linux fix.
Same here. Funny thing is my fiance had to use the VM I had set up to do her homework on. She has an old version of Ubuntu that is apparently not supported anymore so the repos are gone and I wasn't able to do a straight update. So rather than hose her machine I just let her use the VM till I was able to get her laptop fixed. (It is a System programming class that is *nix based).

that Linux guy wrote:
If Wine or Crossover Office was better at handling new games, or these game makers started making Linux-compatable titles, I'd drop Windows in a heartbeat.
Have you tried Crossover Games? I got a free copy a while ago but I haven't used it. http://www.codeweavers.com/products/cxgames/

that Linux guy wrote:
My girlfriend? She'd be lost. She uses my computer and loves her Windows!
I don't think she would be. I mean, if she just browses the web etc? It would take maybe 30 minutes to get used to it.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 4:36 am 
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When I started gaming again, I just bought a 360. Rather than dual-boot, I just hit the 'swap input' button on my monitor and get to fraggin'. ;)

I really don't think that arrogance is the reason linux is not being adopted by more people. There are friendly resources available all over the 'net ... this forum, the official Gentoo and Ubuntu forums ... they've all treated me well.

The reason is more complex than that. Most people don't like to take chances with something they barely understand. My mom hesitates before every mouse click in Windows .. there is no way I could convince her to try linux.

I'd also point out that the majority of those who do tinker with their PCs and are comfortable installing OSes and what-not are also gamers. We all know, despite brilliantly written HOW-TOs in MPC, that gaming and linux do not mix terribly well.

Until linux is a 'drop-DVD-in-slot' installation that includes all the software the average user will need, it won't gain a significant amount of market share.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 4:38 am 
TravBv2.0
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Crash, you're right about the douches. They are the loudest unfortunately. Bad apples ruin the bunch perhaps?

I haven't tried Crossover games yet. I nabbed a couple versions when they were giving them away some months ago, but I too haven't used them yet. I've had nothing but issues with a strait Linux install since I got my HD4870 card. Even after installing drivers with ATI's GUI installer, they didnt' actually install. There was no trace of ATI drivers in my system after doing it twice. I gave up for a while, and started using it in VM and haven't really thought about it much. I keep most of my actual files in Linux, but XP only as Steam and my games.

As for the girlfriend, she mostly browses the web, but she also plays games in spurts. She's hooked on Dungeon Siege: Legends of Arrana right now, but before this it was COD4 online, the Sims, and several stupid flash games like Funky Farm and Virtual Villagers. My gaming rig for flash games.... It's like seeing a Porsche being driven 10mph under every speed limit. :roll: She did get used to Gnome for a bit until I found out how awesome Fluxbox. She gave up after that.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 9:37 am 
SON OF A GUN
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This isn't necessarily a pro-linux thing...

But he is obviously a moron. I am sure Windows is the only thing that doens't shut down instantly (although all of my PCs shut down in < 30 seconds).

http://news.cnet.com/8301-19518_3-10206506-238.html


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 10:01 am 
TravBv2.0
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Jipstyle wrote:
When I started gaming again, I just bought a 360. Rather than dual-boot, I just hit the 'swap input' button on my monitor and get to fraggin'. ;)

I really don't think that arrogance is the reason linux is not being adopted by more people. There are friendly resources available all over the 'net ... this forum, the official Gentoo and Ubuntu forums ... they've all treated me well.

The reason is more complex than that. Most people don't like to take chances with something they barely understand. My mom hesitates before every mouse click in Windows .. there is no way I could convince her to try linux.

I'd also point out that the majority of those who do tinker with their PCs and are comfortable installing OSes and what-not are also gamers. We all know, despite brilliantly written HOW-TOs in MPC, that gaming and linux do not mix terribly well.

Until linux is a 'drop-DVD-in-slot' installation that includes all the software the average user will need, it won't gain a significant amount of market share.


This sort of leads into a totally different debate of PC games VS Console games. I have two cousins and a step-brother who love their consoles. I've spent a bit of time with ever major console since the NES (when I say major, I mean the usual offerings from Sega, Sony, Nintendo, and Microsoft), and I've never gotten the same gaming experience as I have using a PC. Maybe it's because I'm older and can understand the rich story lines, maybe because I spent more on my gaming rig than two PS3s and something deep down inside makes me feel more because I invested more, maybe it's the graphics... Who knows? All I know is I think PC games are better. Leave the console for Sports Game 0-whatever and Animal Crossing. Leave the real gaming to PCs.

While I think Linux would be very welcome to the consumer, it's not worth the inital learning effort for most people. Once I learned a bit about Linux, the way the filesystem's laid out and what each directory is for, some basic commands, getting familiar with the apps, Linux is stupid easy. Couple those basic items with a simple understanding of computers and Linux is a perfect fit. Unfortunately, people don't want to take the time to learn such things.

Hell, even with Windows, most people don't really know anything about windows aside from the web-browser, the "Start" button, and Windows Media Player. Everything else is completely foreign to them. All of that crap and more is available with Linux after installation. All they need is something close to looking like a start button (Kubuntu anyone?) and they're golden.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 11:26 am 
Java Junkie
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CrashTECH wrote:
that Linux guy wrote:
The douches are few and far between, but you know what they say about a bad apple ruining the entire bunch.
The problem here is they have the loudest voice or the biggest podium to spew their shit from.


... from which to spew their shit.

</grammarnazi>

;)


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