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 Post subject: Liquid Cooling - More Case Fans?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 11:27 pm 
Dear Forum,

I plan to build a new desktop with Ivy Bridge I5-3570K and to liquid cool. The video card will be upper midrange, since I'm really not a gamer but need reasonably fast 3-D graphics for visualization on scientific applications. Should I add additional case (HAF 922M) fans for better overall cooling? The CPU should be fine based on reviews of Corsair H60. Thanks for your assistance.


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 Post subject: Re: Liquid Cooling - More Case Fans?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 10:51 am 
Team Member
Team Member

Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2009 12:09 pm
Posts: 565
Well, that case already has 2 200mm fans and a 120mm fan. I think that's enough. Run a few of your simulations and check the CPU and GPU temperatures. If it's running hot, then add side panel fans. Then maybe water cool the gpu also.


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 Post subject: Re: Liquid Cooling - More Case Fans?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 11:50 am 
Smithfield
Smithfield

Joined: Sun Jun 18, 2006 7:37 pm
Posts: 5247
Let's step back a second, because people tend to spend way too much on cooling than they need. Like how people like spending money on 32GB of DDR3-2600 RAM.

First of all, these parts are designed to operate at 40C-50C and last at least several years (probably at least a decade, I dunno, never had a processor die from old age on me). The only thing you buy with lower temperatures is longer component life. Unless you like to build every six years, this should be a moot point. Maybe you don't want to deal with the fan noise, okay, but you don't really need to spend any more on a say a Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo. Or hell, if you have headphones, fan noise shouldn't be a problem anyway.

So really, go back, figure out what's really bugging you. Temperature is nothing to worry about unless you start tapping at 100C on nominal loads (not a burn in test, because that's not a realistic load scenario).


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 Post subject: Re: Liquid Cooling - More Case Fans?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 10:32 pm 
Thanks to all who replied. I shall follow your advice literally. I'm anxious to get started on my build.
cdry31sg


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 Post subject: Re: Liquid Cooling - More Case Fans?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 4:30 pm 
Boy in Black
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Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2004 1:40 pm
Posts: 24339
Location: South of heaven
Water cooling is directly cooling a device more efficiently. So watercooling has the possibility to cool an individual component better (air has the heat absorption rate very close to wood). It literally takes heat directly off the component, moves it through tubes, where it then gets to deal with the air exchange; however, here it is being kicked directly out of the case while internal heatsinks just pump into the case and why a lot of folks rely on having a lot of fans...they have to.

There's a LOT more perks with watercooling than a perceived longer component life. Less fans, less noise, direct cooling so you can overclock better. I've never heard someone want to water cool to make their CPU last longer. I mean, my Pentium II's still work and they were air cooled. What usually fails is another component and not a CPU/GPU.

So to your question, I also feel you're fine with those mammoth 200mm OEM fans. You still want some air moving in and out to cool the other components that will get less without a local fan you're replacing with a waterblock; but you aren't doing yourself any favors by simply adding more fans (+more noise). Depending on what type of kit or loop you are planning, you really might think about getting the GPU in on the H2O fun. The loudest thing in any of my cases, OC'd, stock, or whatever...is the GPU fan. Sure you can get a program to make your own speed ramps vs. temps, but eventually they're still at full tilt when your doing anything aggressive like your 3D work. IMO, H2O just really tames that beast and gets the case back to being reasonable and gentlemanly.

The best way to do this is usually a DIY 3/8" loop, but there's still some boxed GPU kits; albeit rare. The last kit I knew of 1st hand was CoolIt systems, but they've moved on to designing for others (Corsair and Antec mainly) and don't sell their own stuff anymore. They also have their own rads, so the CPU kit needs room for a 120mm fan and the GPU room for it's own rad too. A DIY kit can be planned with a much better rad that will handle both the CPU and GPU in one heat exchanger. Right now, I have a 3350P and a 560Ti on a 3/8" loop going to an ancient Black Ice Extreme 120mm from way back in 2002 or so; does fine.

Here, cost is the big factor and can easily be into this for about $500 initially vs $250 two kitted loops would cost. To me, it's an investment and can use all the parts over and over again on many builds to come, even decades later such as what I'm using. Just change blocks if needed, this costs just as much as a HS/F does, then you're back running again. It's an initial investment and won't cost very much at all if you chose to reuse parts of the loop in another build. With this 11yo investment, I spent $60 on a DD CPU block and $85 on a full coverage DD GPU block. I couldn't get CLOSE to that price or cooling ability going with air cooling equipment.


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 Post subject: Re: Liquid Cooling - More Case Fans?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:28 pm 
Smithfield
Smithfield

Joined: Sun Jun 18, 2006 7:37 pm
Posts: 5247
I'm finding that noise is becoming less of an issue these days. A lot of people are using headphones, which if they're proper, would isolate you from the noise. Even then, a trend on image boards is to get two book shelf speakers and an amp... And you're not going to drive that below a puny 50dB are you?

Cooling has gotten a lot better these days anyway. A decent air cooler kept at the minimum fan setting can keep a processor relatively cool. If anything, it's the video card that's always the leaf blower when you stress it.

While I'm not saying to ditch water cooling in general (okay, maybe I am), think about it. A basic, good quality kit to cool just your CPU has a price entry of $250. If you want to add your GPU to the mix, add another $100-$150. Maintenance is probably minimal (you can buy distilled water by the gallon at Target for a few bucks). Another consideration here is that you have to make sure your case is water cooling friendly. But ultimately, if you've always built a machine whole and never recycled anything (or any core component), the $250 you spent would have to go through... we'll say 5 builds before you recouped the cost by buying a decent air cooler each time.

If you want to get a self contained unit, they're not much better than a decent air cooler.

At best all you're buying here is more thermal headroom for overclocking. But even people have gotten really good overclocks on a high-end air cooler without problem. And that's if you have some desire to overclock in the first place.


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 Post subject: Re: Liquid Cooling - More Case Fans?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:48 pm 
8086
8086

Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2013 1:29 pm
Posts: 1
The system I built I7 3930K Asus p9x79 deluxe 16 GB Crucial Ballistix Elite 1866 Mhz, Corsair H70 core water cooler OC 4.7 Ghz. The H70 with push/pull flow exiting rear of case was hitting 85 C At 100% load with Aida benchmark running very stable. Wasn't happy with the high temps with the H70. i decided to upgrade to H100i. Just prior to dis-assembly I noticed a few drips of coolant from the H70. When removed from the system it was evident the tube to the radiator was leaking, caught it just in time. Don't buy the coolers with the cheap plastic tubing. The H100i has much better quality hoses and is running 15 C cooler under load.


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