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 Post subject: Do you understand SSD MTBF?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 5:33 am 
Clawhammer
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What des an SSD’s MTBF mean for you?

[edit] fixed link


Last edited by kleinkinstein on Mon Jan 07, 2013 7:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Do you understand SSD MTBF?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 6:54 am 
Team Dino
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Umm... I guess it means cases for you, at least according to your link. ;)

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 Post subject: Re: Do you understand SSD MTBF?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 7:25 am 
Clawhammer
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 Post subject: Re: Do you understand SSD MTBF?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 10:48 am 
Team Dino
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For me the MTBF doesn't mean a thing, whether platter or SSD.

For SSD I do look around to see if there are widespread issues, and if they have been fixed with a newer firmware release.

Otherwise I look at the performance/$ ratio.

n0b0dykn0ws


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 Post subject: Re: Do you understand SSD MTBF?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2013 1:02 pm 
Smithfield
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Even if I took MTBF at face value, with my usage patterns, the hardware will be out of my hands long before it reaches a fifth of its expected life.


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 Post subject: Re: Do you understand SSD MTBF?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 8:51 am 
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GOD! How I hate acronyms!!! I had to look it up in Google and found a very interesting article:

http://www.xppower.com/pdfs/MTBF.pdf

It is short and kind of shows you how to build obsolescence into a product. There is an actual formula to do this. :shock: Now you know how you are being screwed when you buy stuff... :lol:

Nasty


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 Post subject: Re: Do you understand SSD MTBF?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 9:15 am 
Smithfield
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Nastyman wrote:
It is short and kind of shows you how to build obsolescence into a product. There is an actual formula to do this. :shock: Now you know how you are being screwed when you buy stuff... :lol:

The only way to "build obsolescence" in a part is to use sub-standard materials. In which case that curve becomes more of a V shape.

It also means you'll get your ass sued.


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 Post subject: Re: Do you understand SSD MTBF?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 10:45 am 
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Quote:
The only way to "build obsolescence" in a part is to use sub-standard materials. In which case that curve becomes more of a V shape.


They do this everyday in the automotive industry, I talked to an engineer that had to design parts to fail at 50,000 miles. They never got sued for doing this, after all it is their business and can do what they please as long as they don't cause injury as a result of the design. They will just loose customers as a result, that is why GM had to be bailed out. Look at Toyota, they design to give you a good lifespan in their products, that is why they are kicking our butt in the Market place today.

If you Designed parts to last forever, everyone would be out of a job because there would be no need to make new products....ever.

Nasty


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 Post subject: Re: Do you understand SSD MTBF?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 11:26 am 
Smithfield
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Again, you would have to use substandard materials that has some high percentage of breaking when it reaches the point you want it to. You can't create something that breaks 100% of the time at some point unless it's deliberately done so (like the ECU telling the part "go break now").

And the whole "if you could design something that lasts forever, people would be out of the job" is bullshit. Tonka has lived on the reputation that under normal use, children can't break their toys and in a rarity of the toy industry, carries a lifetime warranty. And by normal use, well, they really mean "normal use". Not "Jimmy moving it on the carpet back and forth 2 feet".


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 Post subject: Re: Do you understand SSD MTBF?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:30 pm 
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LatiosXT have you ever worked in industry? I have for 48 years and now I am retired. Everything I stated is true, why would I bullsh*t you? For my Ego...hell no. You can design a part to ware out when you want it to without being dangerous to the whole. For instance if I wanted to get more money out of a progressive die I built as in maintenance I would use A2 steel type punches instead of D2 type steel punches. A2 has 5% chrome in it while D2 type steel has 12% chrome in it and will make the punch run twice as long before the ware on the punch made it make parts undersize and would need to be replaced. They do the same in autos to stay in business. They make a whole sh*t pot more money selling replacement parts than they do a car. You should spend some time reading up on how the economy works before posting anything else.

Nasty


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 Post subject: Re: Do you understand SSD MTBF?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:07 pm 
Smithfield
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Just because you've had this experience in one industry that wants to nickel and dime everyone doesn't mean everyone else wants to. Because I already provided a counterexample of a company that follows (or at least followed) the "build the damn thing to last" model and was successful.

Also that's not really planned obsolescence, that's more like building shitty products.

That aside, there's another side of the coin to this that involves cost to the manufacturer and consumer among other things. If a company making a car for example, decides that they want a useful life of 150,000 miles for say 95% of the vehicles produced, then they're going to commit engineering to build a car that will meet that requirement in the cheapest fashion. If they built the car to meet that requirement, but in reality will satisfy a requirement of 300,000 miles for 95% of vehicles produced, either they found some material that met the requirement, cost, and pricing that the consumer is willing to pay, or they've over engineered the product and are going to take a hit in net revenue.

So if the demand for an auto-replacement part is 50,000 miles, then that's all your bosses are going to want so it affects the bottom line as little as possible. Is it the right thing to do? That's more or less a gray area.


Last edited by LatiosXT on Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Do you understand SSD MTBF?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:17 pm 
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You sound like a young man and you need to get into the workforce and find out for yourself because there just isn't anyway else to convince you otherwise.... :wink:

Nasty


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 Post subject: Re: Do you understand SSD MTBF?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 3:24 pm 
Smithfield
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Nastyman wrote:
You sound like a young man and you need to get into the workforce and find out for yourself because there just isn't anyway else to convince you otherwise.... :wink:

Nasty

I posted a reply. And I am in the workforce that builds training equipment. You're just an old person who's too stubborn to look at things in another way. :P


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 Post subject: Re: Do you understand SSD MTBF?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 5:52 am 
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I have been told by many people down through the years that I am a very open minded person, this is the first time I have been told that I am a stubborn old guy... :lol: :lol: I am trying to educate you in the facts of life in the economy and you just won't open your narrow mind to anything but what you think is right. :roll: Talk to someone that owns a manufacturing business, it will be a real eye opener.

Nasty


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 Post subject: Re: Do you understand SSD MTBF?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2013 7:44 am 
Clawhammer
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LatiosXT wrote:
I am in the workforce that builds training equipment.


Sweet! As in training are we talking white boards, dry erase markers and donuts. Or gym towels, dumbbells and gel packets? :P


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 Post subject: Re: Do you understand SSD MTBF?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 28, 2013 12:19 am 
8086
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Nastyman wrote:
GOD! How I hate acronyms!!! I had to look it up in Google and found a very interesting article:

http://www.xppower.com/pdfs/MTBF.pdf

It is short and kind of shows you how to build obsolescence into a product. There is an actual formula to do this. :shock: Now you know how you are being screwed when you buy stuff... :lol:

Nasty


Thanks.. This is really helpful.


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