Maximum PC

I really want to try and run with the big boys and get some of the -bigadv points this coming year and have some questions; some may not be able to be answered currently given the state of folding points. I've so far gone beyond my good wits and lurked the [H] forums as I don't see 2P/4P farms mentioned much here, but I ain't going to post over there about folding

I have the ability to purchase the guts of a 2P SQL server after a failed work project. The offer right now is about the same cost of just the CPU so I'm considering it pretty heavily.

Here, let me gather the links to the basic parts
• Asus Z8NA-D6C
• 2.4Ghz Westmere-EPE 5645

It's in a Dell 2U case which I don't really dig if it were at home, but think I can sneak it into another rack at work. It's working just fine with just one CPU which is a plus for me currently so I can add another CPU later to get the 12 cores. So here's where you folding gurus guide me with the plethora of questions.
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1) I was watching for the E7 Xeons to be released and build my own when this just happened to pop up. So back my conscience up here a bit...there's not going to be an E7 Xeon under $2K right? The 8830 octal (Hex w/ HT) is out and I've even been given a quote of $2260 (after discounts) for one unit which is just nuts IMO. I've been snubbed on any water cooler talk of a cheaper 6 core, and sounds like the 8's are already neutered 10's. I know it's speculation on hardware stuff, but just erase that thought out of my head. If you don't shake the idea out of me, it may stick and do something stupid (imagine that).

2) I want a folding mini-monster finally, but can you justify it for me? With the CPU's at 100% 24/7, it wouldn't do much else would it? I'd like to think of something it can do besides sit there and do those little things like cure diseases. At home or work I have a 1M up line max, so...what can you also do with a folding machine? I can't even serve a 4-player Minecraft server with those internet speeds.

3) Memory may be pretty easy too considering the answers from "2" above and that I jump on this offer. UDIMM right? Would registered DIMMS help with folding at all? I have speculation that ECC might technically help a project, but we're talking minutes in return times at best.

4) Cooling. 2U limits me obviously, but if I can find a 4U space would that even matter? Good coolers are towers and are at least 6U. Should I let them run hot or get into CAD and start building an H20 outfit. The chipset on this Asus board seems Presc-hott just idling. Whether I'm hosting this at work or home, the fans can NOT be at server sound levels.

5) Now the tough one: the -BigAdv speculations. I've been running "big WU" in the SMP config for the i7, but that's not the same as the -bigadv flag right? I currently get more ppd with v7 than I did with Fred's VM. If I truly want to run with the big boys I need...what? The one CPU will net 12 threads, so that's enough to qualify for the points I assume. Deadlines and points are up in the air, but will just running 12 cores boost me a bit or will it just maintain ?

6) Dump this and build a dually Oppie Hex? I'm just trying to qualify for the -BigAdv points here you see. Plans of dual AMD 16-core machines or go with and build up the Intel "12-core" starter and go from there? Will actual core counts matter in your opinion? I've read that 100K ppd is a walk in the park with a hex Opteron, know points aren't linear, and just ponder this from the folding aspect. I'll max out with 32 cores with AMD and 24 with the Intel route. As with "4", is it all about the time limits after the core qualifier?

7) Basically, what do you 11108 guys with over 100K ppd do!? How can I play with you guys? I've just been hamfisted in my folding IMO and want to really do a lot more. I'm at 50K on a usable box (Finally made top 20!) and it'd take me a full year and a lot of money to do it again. If I made another box like this, I'd be out of date by 2013. I want those 100K bonuses; so guide me please.
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Thanks for reading (TL/DNR folks need not apply), thanks for pondering with me, and thanks for any advice! I know it's a set of complicated questions, but I'm a complicated individual. I remember when getting 500ppd was an epitome, I almost got there when I was gutter trash broke, and I really want this new benchmark this time. I've been sick of stagnant team top 1000, 500, top 100, and since 2004 I am now getting top 20 appearances. To get into the top 10 with this awesome team (with honest efforts) means a lot to me. Can I get a 100K ppd bump with any of this drivel?

I've been casually posting for less than a year and not followed all the details as closely as I could. I did though read the thread about the end of Bigadv for any computer with less than 16 cores.
Does anyone know the status of Bigadv? Is that still the plan? When is it supposed to end for 8 thread, 8 core and 12 core machines?

16th of this month, here is the thread on it. http://www.maximumpc.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=127713

#2 - NAS (if installed at home)? CPU resources for that would be low.
#4 - Cooler is always better, IMO. Big investments should be protected.
#5 - "big WU" and BigAdv are two different things. As Crossfire mentioned, the new requirement will be 16 logical cores. 12 won't get you into the club, but it will put you between the velvet ropes just outside.
#6 - On the consumer side of things, Intel has been beating AMD at folding. Not sure if that translates over to the server side.
#7 - Unless he has changed, Doc was using numerous boxes (20+ at one time, IIRC) with a mix of CPU and GPU in each. Gary480six and swaynes might be the same. WikingTOR and aspen_ozone have the use of (corporate?) servers.

I've been lurking on the H forum too I've gathered that a decent 4P Opteron machine can be put together for as little as $1500. Here's the breakdown:
Proc - 4x 6128s - $100 ea
Mobo - supermicro 4P - $640-720
Psu - $100-120
Memory - $50 or 100 x4 (DDR 3 1600, 1.35v cas 11 or cas 7, iirc) - non-registered, unbuffered (desktop memory)
Case - $100ish
Hsf - $30ea (maybe less or more)
Hdd - $---

The procs can later. Be subbed out with ones that are much nicer (6174s - $) or maybe the newer future 20 core procs next year
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?t ... 20-core.29

#7 - Unless he has changed, Doc was using numerous boxes (20+ at one time, IIRC) with a mix of CPU and GPU in each. Gary480six and swaynes might be the same. WikingTOR and aspen_ozone have the use of (corporate?) servers.

doc is looking into servers also.

#7 - Unless he has changed, Doc was using numerous boxes (20+ at one time, IIRC) with a mix of CPU and GPU in each. Gary480six and swaynes might be the same. WikingTOR and aspen_ozone have the use of (corporate?) servers.

Yup - 20+ boxes doing SMP work units.. and a handful of GPU Folding cards. No 2P or 4P systems and no -Bigadv systems here.

[quote="g.m.waters (red ranger3)
doc is looking into servers also.[/quote]

If one is a serious folder, it's the bast way to go. Power consumption is much lower and points come in ten fold for the same power. 600-800 Watts and you can get 400k-500k+ ppd off of one machine! What's not to love!

Whoe, about reported you...button is too close to "quote". Hope the back button saved it quickly.

Yeah, I got lost in simple numbers there for a bit or was just thinking to myself (I meant "...later to get 12 more cores"). I'm assuming 12 won't do it with one CPU as it is and will have to SMP it. To add another would be another 12, bringing the thread count to 24 and easily fit into the -bigadv area. And that's a problem I'm having. A 2P AMD board is no less than $400 and a 4P board might be just $500...but the slower 16-core CPU's are cheap in comparison. I'm looking at a 12-core Intel with an empty socket Asus at $550. $600 nets another 12-cores and well under $1,500. We don't have a huge used section here were 2P/4P parts are just laying around...so, we're at this point.
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Doc, let's talk! If you want me to jump first to get some 11108 data on server farming, and -bigadv in general, (LOL...about said "big Pharm'n...way out of context) let's do it. I just need help as things can't be this simple, as I've thought nothing but "GPU, GPU, GPU" when all we needed this whole time was one little box with a CPU Core count to qualify? If I had known I could have just ran a CPU to get 50K ppd, I'd have done it years ago. It's not about the points, but it is. I feel I'm wasting time if I'm not getting points (They make points, so points mean good things for the cause I have to assume).

It's tax season in a world of change, so my budget is in the air right now. Let me get my W2 and go through it before I spout off about finishing this thing off. 12-cores right now and about to fire off for 11108 by midnight. (yeah, I jumped on it)

Doc should just do this:

http://www.wiredzone.com/Supermicro-SBA ... 0656~0.htm
along with this:

http://www.wiredzone.com/Supermicro-SBE ... 9391~0.htm

then add the procs, memory and you're really ready to fold

Add more of the first as needed.

I don't think that anyone posted the link, so here is the goldmine of a thread at the Hard forum:
http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1652906

Lots of great ideas and everything there.

Someone just built a 4P system for around $1350 w/o a case that gets 230k-250k PPD.

Since there's already a thread on the subject, I figure I should probably ask here.
As you know, I've been away for a while. I've kinda fallen out of the loop of folding.

I've got a server that appears to qualify for bigadv. Eventually it's going to be my Hyper-V system hosting a Windows Deployment Server, among other things, but for the meantime, I want to fold on it to *ahem* burn it in.

Doing a bit of Googling turns up some old info. Some place said you need to have a passkey in order to get bonus points. Is this still true? If so, where would I go to get a passkey? They also recommended folding at least one WU using the advanced methods flag to qualify for bonus points. Is this still necessary as well?

Also, while this server has enough cores, the clockspeed is a bit on the low side (2x Opteron 6168 @ 1.9Ghz) Is that going to be enough?

Geez, I feel like a newb again.

Currently, I've got it folding using the -bigadv -smp flags. I'm hoping this works. Kinda looks like it:

You must fold 10 smp wu to get the bonus points while also running a passkey. After this you can run bigadv.
This is where you go to get the passkey.
Here is more passkey info if your interested.

Running bigadv without a passkey will give you horrible results. For an example before the rules changed and you could still use quad cores with hyper threading you could get something like ~70,000 points for a unit. The same unit without the passkey, ie no bonus points would give you less than 10k. GET THAT KEY QUICK, and qualify it using just smp units as they complete so much faster.

Cool. Thanks for the reply. I'll get that set up tonight on a few of my SMP boxes so that I can get that taken care of quickly. That's a hell of a difference in points. Yikes!

**edit**
Is it as simple as stopping the client, running it with the -configonly flag, adding the passkey, then Re-launching with the -smp flag (they were already running with the -smp flag prior, only without a passkey)? I just did that on a couple of clients, so hopefully it accepts that.

hummm... $1300 for 250k ppd machine? I think that's what I want to get next! hehe

It is that simple. Just be aware the passkey won't actually be in effect until the next WUs are downloaded. Use of the passkey is not retroactive on previously folded/downloaded WUs.

It sounds like you are using -smp as an argument from the command line when launching the client. You can set that in the "additional parameters" question of the config, if you want, but it certainly isn't necessary.

Oh, and WELCOME BACK!

Back !!

I was thinking down the line TWballs is here, and am steering clear at this point. I've seen the $1.4K 4P builds that have been getting 200+ppd, but this -bigadv change could very well change all of that. I've got 101 questions on that change, could take a thread of it's own as -bigadv points roll in soon, but time will only tell as far as we all know.

The good thing you have going TWballs is that you have the hardware already and it's known to be solid. What I'm wondering on that 6180 2P (and even this one I'm biting the bullet on) is if the new deadlines shrink down drastically or if it's just a small shrink like in July of '11. The way I understand it from reading around, QRP's are not intended to be for Joe Shmoe's (like most of us) with desktops. It goes above my head from there (as it's not discussed in forums so much), but I assume this: A 2600K that turns in a WU twice as fast as a 2P 12-core rig is not netting the same results as desired. I could go in depth why I assume this (which wouldn't be a good read), so I give the thought of being given a report on Monday that's due on Friday; Turned in on Tuesday. Is it the same well thought out report it should have been? Is fast full of holes and shorter deadlines keep the average kids from getting bonuses?

I see many brains out there with 16-Core Opties pondering if they're in need of a rebuild as well. They get QRP's now with the proper core count, but what about the deadlines? While the QRB is raised to 16-cores, the time limits may be shrunk drastically so that no 8 core could reach the target; and those that hack 8-cores to look like 16 don't make it either (which makes sense to me). 12-core's might hack to look like 16's and meet deadlines (OC'ing SR-2 users), but for how long?

I hope it's a big move and it lasts a while, which is pretty much my original point. I don't think it's "just" a core count, they do see ahead, and want higher-end servers for good results and not living room gaming machines (see: "it's not about points, but it is" prior statement). It's a wait-and-see TWballs. Get your Passkey, fold away, and feed back for us in two week or so when you start to see final results too as many are waiting. I'm getting Unstable Machine on v6 w/ a machine I just beat to death to validate stability.
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I'm frustrated, but not so much I've given up hope to get this thing up for 11108. There's some flux in the folding world now, I don't understand this old world I should have jumped aboard for years ago let alone what the new world brings to us, and will do what I can to understand what I can in the time being in order to inform. For the cure and to the team!

I have one bone to pick with you there chum. An SR-2 user would only have 12 cores if they had one 6/12 cpu.... which I believe is possible but most owners would populate both sockets. Any time you fill both cpu seats you would have a min of 8/16. HT still meets the 16 core deadlines from what I have read.

Definitely a frustrating situation that I dont completely understand.

I see what Chumly is saying about the deadlines. Best to have a little breathing room rather than just squeaking by.

While I was folding BigAdv on my i7 950, it sneakily met the core count through HT and folded happily for large PPD. Then along came the project we all complained about (p6701, I think it was) that pushed me really close to the deadline. Anything more than a minor hiccup and I was out of the bonus. No fun getting mostly stuff you can run OK, then along comes one that you won't make the deadline on but you have to chew on it until it's done knowing there won't be a bonus for it because trashing it to get a more favorable one is not allowed and REALLY UNCOOL. So you spin the WU wheel and hope the WHAMMY doesn't come up each time. IMO, if you can't finish anything thrown at you comfortably within the deadline (barring unexpected snafus), you are probably under-powered to fold at that level.

The run-on sentences are starting so it's time for me to stop writing. I made my point. I just hope it was somewhat comprehend-able.