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 Post subject: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:36 am 
Smithfield
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I'm going to try and get back into some mild programming for personal interest and maybe to prepare for a career change.

I prefer to use C/C++ right now since I'm the most familiar with that but I'm willing to try other languages as I get caught up.

What free IDEs and database servers do you recommend? I've found Netbeans and MySQL but are they good?


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 9:45 am 
SON OF A GUN
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http://www.microsoft.com/express/Downloads/
Get C# and SQL Express. .NET is a good way to make sure you'll always have access to some kind of work.

MySQL is okay for hobbiests, but if you want to be serious about databases career wise. Learn MS SQL and Oracle. In my experience MySQL has a much smaller feature set and just isn't used professionally. Saying Facebook uses it isn't good enough. It might be big in F/OSS world but there really isn't any money in F/OSS. Not good money anyway.

I haven't used Netbeans but I can't imagine it is too much different than Eclipse. Eclipse was okay. (Used it for Java and C++). I used Zend (not free) for some PHP work and I thought it did an okay job.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 10:43 am 
Smithfield
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Can a person that only knows C++ learn C# on the fly or would they need to read up on it before diving in?


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 10:53 am 
Java Junkie
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Satchboy wrote:
Can a person that only knows C++ learn C# on the fly or would they need to read up on it before diving in?


Honestly, if you know C++ and maybe some Java, C# will be like relearning a language. It is one of the easiest languages I've picked up.

You'll have to do some reading, obviously, but it is a great language to learn. Functional, useful and very much in demand.

Basically, Crash++


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 10:57 am 
SON OF A GUN
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You'll be just fine after a few online tutorials.

I actually have some resources from a course I took (work sent me, I didn't really need to go) that might be helpful that had virtual labs and stuff. If you are interested PM me and we can figure out how to get it to you.

Also, love http://stackoverflow.com/


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:27 pm 
Northwood
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Learning C# from scratch is possible and still easier than C++ but start it with some example code//libraries you can reference from.

And figure out how to render directx in an mdi form as a child. I will love you if you can figure that out in C# heh.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 5:01 am 
SON OF A GUN
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Dwood15 wrote:
And figure out how to render directx in an mdi form as a child.
WHY!?!?!


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 5:38 am 
Smithfield
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Thanks for the replies.

Crash I'll browse the intertubes to get me started. I might take you up on that offer later if I need it.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2011 11:27 pm 
Northwood
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CrashTECH wrote:
Dwood15 wrote:
And figure out how to render directx in an mdi form as a child.
WHY!?!?!


It is impossible to do in C#.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 5:04 am 
SON OF A GUN
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Nothing is impossible...


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 7:27 am 
Bitchin' Fast 3D Z8000
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Satchboy wrote:
I prefer to use C/C++ right now since I'm the most familiar with that but I'm willing to try other languages as I get caught up.


C# is a good language to start off with. I also recommend Ruby (with Ruby on Rails) and Python.

Satchboy wrote:
What free IDEs and database servers do you recommend? I've found Netbeans and MySQL but are they good?


Visual Studio, definitely, for C#.

CrashTech wrote:
MySQL is okay for hobbiests, but if you want to be serious about databases career wise. Learn MS SQL and Oracle. In my experience MySQL has a much smaller feature set and just isn't used professionally. Saying Facebook uses it isn't good enough. It might be big in F/OSS world but there really isn't any money in F/OSS. Not good money anyway.


I'd agree with the MySQL comment, but to call it hobbyist is far from it. Its feature set isn't something to scoff at, MySQL is fast. Buddy of mine used it when doing trading; they stored network information, stock values, etc. on it - MySQL not only handled the load but ran faster than SQL Server, Oracle and PostgreSQL. Their software algorithms had to make split-second trades, and it aggregated data for decisions on MySQL.

Also, Facebook isn't really using MySQL, IIRC. They're doing more NoSQL where they use hashes to store data. It's quicker and you can replicate across multiple nodes better than, say, merge replication. I'd disagree with your F/OSS comment, money is good with F/OSS (low TCO for IT Departments), even I'm making the F/OSS jump and I love C#.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2011 7:32 am 
Bitchin' Fast 3D Z8000
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Satchboy wrote:
Can a person that only knows C++ learn C# on the fly or would they need to read up on it before diving in?


I did. I left University with only C++ in my belt, my first job afterwards was writing ASP.NET applications using C# on ASP.NET 1.1 (wow, so long ago!).

C# isn't hard, but it's got some C++ things that were left out. Things like multiple inheritance - that's a no-go in C#. C# has managed types, C++ doesn't. Unsigned types in C# are unmanaged (IIRC) whereas they're not in C++.

The nice things about C#? Well, if you're a C++ guy, the syntax is a hybrid of Java and C#. Threading looks like POSIX threading in C++. Also, if you really like C++, you can drop down to C++.NET - which gives you C++ with the added benefit of .NET types. Sure, marking a class managed seems a bit weird, but it's a good intro to C# if you're coming deep from C++. Also, C# has unsafe and volatile keywords, so you can do C++ hooks.

I've been sold on C# since I touched it, it's by far one of the best languages I've written in.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 12:44 pm 
Smithfield
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@DJSpin

Way back when I was learning some C++ and learning it's awesome powers. I was never a real programmer to begin with but I liked to think I picked up a lot of core principles and got a good idea of what was possible with it. During this time I heard about C# being an up and coming thing, but while I don't remember specifics, I do remember hearing how it would drop some important functionality that C++ had. I realize I'm being vauge but isnt that true? In C++ you can create kernels, write sections of ASM code etc, the sky is the limit. C# dropped at least some of the powerful-and-scary-hard stuff... right?

Obviously the majority of programmers don't NEED to be doing any of that, but in my young mind I liked that C++ was as powerful as just about anything else. Most programmers are control freaks, you honestly prefer C# with its loss of control?


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 2:13 pm 
SON OF A GUN
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urmumsacow wrote:
@DJSpin

Way back when I was learning some C++ and learning it's awesome powers. I was never a real programmer to begin with but I liked to think I picked up a lot of core principles and got a good idea of what was possible with it. During this time I heard about C# being an up and coming thing, but while I don't remember specifics, I do remember hearing how it would drop some important functionality that C++ had. I realize I'm being vauge but isnt that true? In C++ you can create kernels, write sections of ASM code etc, the sky is the limit. C# dropped at least some of the powerful-and-scary-hard stuff... right?

Obviously the majority of programmers don't NEED to be doing any of that, but in my young mind I liked that C++ was as powerful as just about anything else. Most programmers are control freaks, you honestly prefer C# with its loss of control?


IMO C\C++ and C# are for pretty different tasks. Lack of "control" has never stopped me with C#.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 2:26 pm 
Java Junkie
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Yeah ... if the 'lack of control' keeps you from accomplishing something .. chances are pretty good that you're doing it wrong.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2011 3:28 pm 
Northwood
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It's irritating to write static classes just to make, and call a function that needs no class. That part makes me think the programmers got high off oop.


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 5:54 am 
SON OF A GUN
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Dwood15 wrote:
It's irritating to write static classes just to make, and call a function that needs no class. That part makes me think the programmers got high off oop.
It is irritating to have something like this? It is annoying to have your generic stuff organized into one location?

Code:
namespace Common
{
   public static class Utilities
   {
      public static string GetSomeUsefulStringData()
      {
         ...
      }
   }
}


Mr Wood (hahah) I think you need to look into some real design patterns and methodologies. It is really going to work against you to "hate" on things (unless you are hating on LISP or VB.NET, that I'll allow). :)


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 10:36 am 
Northwood
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CrashTECH wrote:
Dwood15 wrote:
It's irritating to write static classes just to make, and call a function that needs no class. That part makes me think the programmers got high off oop.
It is irritating to have something like this? It is annoying to have your generic stuff organized into one location?

Code:
namespace Common
{
   public static class Utilities
   {
      public static string GetSomeUsefulStringData()
      {
         ...
      }
   }
}


Mr Wood (hahah) I think you need to look into some real design patterns and methodologies. It is really going to work against you to "hate" on things (unless you are hating on LISP or VB.NET, that I'll allow). :)


Mr. Tech, I'm not sure you realize it, however in C# Namespaces are pointless, just use classes.

And now, let me show you how it should be:

Code:
namespace Utilities
{
      public string doStringStuff()
    {
    }
}


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 10:39 am 
SON OF A GUN
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How are namespaces pointless (hint, they aren't!)? Have you ever worked with something that has 10+ projects? Or 300k+ lines?


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 Post subject: Re: Getting back into programming.
PostPosted: Fri Mar 04, 2011 3:54 pm 
Northwood
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CrashTECH wrote:
How are namespaces pointless (hint, they aren't!)? Have you ever worked with something that has 10+ projects? Or 300k+ lines?


You're using the wrong programming language for a 300k+ line project...


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