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 Post subject: p4 FSB
PostPosted: Thu Sep 30, 2004 6:31 pm 
Thunderbird
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im buying a p4 for ocing only and was wondering if i bought some nice high end ram would i need a 800 FSB or could i just go 533?
im saying like DDR 550 ram or could i go lower ram and go for the 800
looking at prolly getting a 2.4 or 2.6 and also whats the difference with letters after the core speed. (B,C,E etc.)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 01, 2004 11:30 am 
Thunderbird
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come on i know someone can help me


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 01, 2004 3:10 pm 
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I'm an OCZ whore, so I like their Gold line. PC4000 Gold is great stuff. Crucial came out with a Ballistix line that is tearing up the reviews. And you have the old faithfuls, Corsair XMS and Mushkin Black. Avoid the generic stuff like the plague, and spend the extra cash on the enthusiast lines rather than going for name brand's value selection.

'B' = 533MHz (133x4) frontside bus
'C' = 800MHz (200x4) frontside bus
'E' = Prescott

On a socket 478 system, go with a C. For what you're wanting to do, anywhere in the 2.4-2.8 range is perfect.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 01, 2004 3:30 pm 
Thunderbird
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alright thanks for the info
but would i be better for me to get the 533 or the 800
i would think the 800 bc it would be a great leap from the 533 to the 800 right?


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 01, 2004 3:36 pm 
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The 800, hence my 'C' recommendation. :)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 01, 2004 7:08 pm 
Celeron
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filmbot wrote:
alright thanks for the info
but would i be better for me to get the 533 or the 800
i would think the 800 bc it would be a great leap from the 533 to the 800 right?


i would go w/ the 800fsb 'cuz of the HT advantage. it's also a tidbit faster when comparing clock for clock.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 8:52 am 
Little Foot
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I am hearing that anything lower than 3.2 in the Northwoods might not oc as well as 3.2c or 3.4c. Intel is using bottom of teh barrel cores for the lower-end Northwoods. Same source also notes that at the moment the best Northwood is the 3.4C as it is based on a Gallatin core (core for the EE but not quite up to EE specs) and it only comes in the desirable 30-cap variety. Hopefuly, it is within your budget.

As for ram don't limit your search based on DDR spped alone. There are some very nice PC3200 (DDR400) ram out there that oc very well. Try to match your ram and proc overclock so you can run at 1:1.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 6:45 pm 
Thunderbird
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if i wanted to run at 1:1 timings wouldnt i want way faster ram so the FSB would compensate? (spelling error)
also as of now i cant really go over the 3ghz mark as for budget

edit: nevermind i think i fit an extra 20 to 30$ into my budget to up it to 3ghz. i heard that when you get this fast of a proc that you cant really oc that much more and pretty much hit a wall. is this true? sorry for all the questions i just want to get all my facts straight.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 8:17 am 
Little Foot
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On the question of Ram:I thought I would mention that you do not necessarily have to have PC4000 ram to run at DDR500. Some PC3200 ram can overclock over DDR400 speeds. I am not the pro and canot tell you why some ram are called PC3200 but are great for overclocking and others are called PC4000 (and all teh numbers in between)

I think the one set of ram I am thinking of is given a PC3200 rating(?) because it easily runs with tight timings at DDR400 but overclocks well when you push up the FSB (and widen the timings). Whereas PC4000 may not run as well at DDR400 speeds but is designed to really shine when run at DDR500.

IMO if you plan to run 24/7 at 1:1 with the FSB@250 (if your proc can reach this) I would go for the PC4000 ram. If you want flexibility to run at stock speeds and overclocked speeds then I would look for ram that can run well at both

FYI - Ram timings are different from running 1:1

For the proc
IMO all procs will oc to some extent and some particular procs are better at it than others (read sometimes it the luck of the draw). With 3.0C some were very good overclockers but lately I have seen folks hitting a ceiling at 3.5GHz (I have one of these procs). Mind you 3.5GHz is not that bad. It is just not stellar.

Some suggest looking for a 3.0C with 30-caps or a pack date after Feb-04 for good overclockers but I have heard of 12-cappers oc'ing well and procs dated before Feb-04 oc well. So it looks like it's more the luck of the draw.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 3:00 pm 
Celeron
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you're probably talking about the the "222" ram that runs at PC3200. it's tricky advertising. some people look at faster rated mem, and some people look at better rated latencies. the truth is, the "222" type of ram are meant to do DDR500, but the manufacturer rates them at DDR400 and tighten up the lat's. I dont know if this is true or not for Crucial's Ballistix or OCZ's EB, but this is true for the companies that use fast Samsung mem, like Corsair, Mushkin, and OCZ.

If it were me, i'd just go towards faster rated mem because you're almost guaranteed to hit those speeds, and they run LL's at ddr400 speeds.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 4:40 pm 
Thunderbird
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so in conclusion what should i do?
get the high performance OCZ
or
some nice DDR 400 value ram?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 4:41 pm 
Smithfield*
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if you want a good overclock get the OCZ


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 4:45 pm 
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If you're building a P4C rig for overclocking, the conclusion is to get some high rated RAM. A 2.4-2.8C chip is begging for the frontside bus to be widened. The higher you go, you'll find that the latencies get relaxed and don't come into play. Bandwidth, bandwidth, bandwidth - pump that fsb.

While high quality PC3200 with low timings will usually have headroom for overclocking past DDR400 speeds when relaxing those timings, chances are you will not have the headroom that PC3700 or PC4000 will provide.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 4:49 pm 
Smithfield*
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check this
should be good


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 4:52 pm 
Celeron
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gramaton cleric wrote:
check this
should be good


too much headroom, imo. PSYCHE! :D

i dont know, though. the Gold series is supposedly better. still, it's rated at DDR533, so you cant really complain.

filmbot, you should also look into a high quality cooler. (drop the link, One4u2c!)

edit: opps, forgot to bait it. :D<---- click teh smiley.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 4:59 pm 
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ocnoob wrote:
i dont know, though. the Gold series is supposedly better.

filmbot, you should also look into a high quality cooler. (drop the link, One4u2c!)


I'd recommend Gold as well, it's GOOD stuff.

As for the link, gone are the days when you can pick up that Zalman for $33 from eWiz! :cry: I noticed the last couple days they've been selling both versions for $44, whereas it used to break done like this:

CNPS7000a-cu - $36 shipped
CNPS7000-cu - $33 shipped

I would advise to keep checking back on those links and see if they lower it again - save yourself a good $10+.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 5:07 pm 
Thunderbird
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yea i had planned on getting that HSF soon
i have to wait to get my new case so i can put my new mobo in
so right now im trying to stockpile stuff so when i do i can just put it in at once
as for right now im just gonna go with my first thought and get the gold seems like a lot of headroom to work with and if i cant use it all just resell it and get some nice value ram


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 5:08 pm 
Celeron
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One4u2c wrote:
As for the link, gone are the days when you can pick up that Zalman for $33 from eWiz! :cry:


boooooo!!!

in that case, the "a" revision is the better buy.

side note: anyone spotted the new rev. "b" version yet?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 5:12 pm 
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I've only seen it on Zalman's website, but haven't found an etailer that carries it yet. I also haven't checked in a couple weeks either, but I'm assuming you have, hence the question :)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 7:26 pm 
Little Foot
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One possible question with PC4000 - will it run well at lower speeds (DDR400) in case a good oc'er cannot be found with the 2.4 or 2.8 procs? If you know the proc will run with FSB@250 and you are planning to run at that speed then sure go for PC4000. If you are not sure of the proc and if PC4000 will not run well at lower speeds then why not go for the tighter PC3200 with more flexibility? It may not reach the same speeds but neither may the proc.

Sorry filmbot. I guess I'm not helping you with a definitive answer.

Of course there's another point to consider. If the plan is to update the proc at a later date to one that will run at 250 then picking up PC4000 is just planning for the future. Personally I picked up OCZ PC3700EB when I could. It'll run faster than my 3.0C but my plans are to keep the ram and toss the 3.0C for a 3.4C once I can find a deal.


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