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 Post subject: 1 GIG or 2 DDR 3200? HELP!
PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 6:16 pm 
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I just got my Mobo and AMD 3000+ 939 64 CPU I also got 1 GIG (2 512) of ram. BUT I screwed up and got 4 of the 512 DDR sticks I paid $113 for each set of 2 so do I send 1 GIG back and get my money back or just install it?

I could use to get the cash back BUT if the performance would improve enough to make it worth my while i will bite the bullet and put it in!

Kevin


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 6:32 pm 
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send the two sticks back, money is better spent elsewhere like a videocard or a hard drive or optical


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 6:50 pm 
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OK well I have a Radeon 9800 Pro so Vid card isnt really needed at the moment. I have a Benq 8X DVD R RW

any other opinions?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 6:56 pm 
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It's BEST to have 1 gig of extremely high qaulity RAM (think crucial ballistix, Muskin V-2, OCz platinum, G-Skill, HyperX) then 2 gig of moderate RAM.

Thinking in this mindset, where do you end up at?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2005 10:37 pm 
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Does that really apply though if you've bought 4 512MB sticks of all the same type of RAM?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 3:03 am 
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I bought Crucial "value select" matched pairs


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 Post subject: Re: 1 GIG or 2 DDR 3200? HELP!
PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 4:45 am 
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TechnoWeenie wrote:
I just got my Mobo and AMD 3000+ 939 64 CPU I also got 1 GIG (2 512) of ram. BUT I screwed up and got 4 of the 512 DDR sticks I paid $113 for each set of 2 so do I send 1 GIG back and get my money back or just install it?

I could use to get the cash back BUT if the performance would improve enough to make it worth my while i will bite the bullet and put it in!

Kevin


This really depends on your mobo, can your mobo take 2 gigs of double sided ram or is it a mix of DS & SS?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 4:06 pm 
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It's best to have more available resources on hand than to fall short.

stick to the two gigs...they would come in handy down the line for editing video, using photoshop, or possibly playing high-end games.


Here's a screenshot of my page file comitting two gigs of physical ram, using Adobe Creative Suite's Photoshop CS.

Image


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 4:34 pm 
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LOL OMG 1.91 GB of page file usage?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2005 4:54 pm 
Willamette
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Flytrap7 wrote:
Does that really apply though if you've bought 4 512MB sticks of all the same type of RAM?


Quote:
so do I send 1 GIG back and get my money back or just install it?

I could use to get the cash back BUT if the performance would improve enough to make it worth my while i will bite the bullet and put it in!


Send the all the gigs back and buy one gig of High Performance RAM such as Crucial Ballistix.



Quote:
It's best to have more available resources on hand than to fall short.

stick to the two gigs...they would come in handy down the line for editing video, using photoshop, or possibly playing high-end games.



There is no reason at all for him to NEED 2 gig of RAM unless he is doing video editing, photoshop, and high end gaming, ALL at the SAME friggin time. Sure, then your going to eat your resources then. 1 gig of quality RAM and a 1.5 gig page file is all that's needed today for GENERAL usage such as gaming, video editing, etc. It's best to have one gig of lowest latency RAM then 2 gig of high latency RAM. And, when you need more, buy another gig of the high performance RAM. So instead of having two gigs of crap, you'll have two gigs of stuff that is much faster.


Last edited by InstigatorX on Thu Mar 17, 2005 4:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 11, 2005 9:56 am 
Coppermine
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WizKid45 wrote:
LOL OMG 1.91 GB of page file usage?

:shock: I got the 1.91 Gb pagefile usage by editing a .tiff image in Photoshop.



InstigatorX wrote:
There is no reason at all for him to NEED 2 gig of RAM unless he is doing video editing,
photoshop, and high end gaming, ALL at the SAME friggin time.

In the screenshot, Photoshop was the only memory intensive app running. NO GAMING, NO VIDEO EDITING, HENCE, the eight percent CPU usage. Who are you trying to BS?
InstigatorX wrote:
Send the all the gigs back and buy one gig of High Performance RAM such as Crucial Ballistix.

Kevin has a 64bit proc. With the arrival of Windows' 64 bitOS coming out next month, it would be advisable to keep the 2 gigs of Crucial value ram.
For example: While 16-bit (DOS6) computing was contorted, slow and buggy, it could well perform the type of tasks that were feasible on the amounts of RAM that were affordable in those days. We're talking about 2-16MB. Try running that RAM on an upgraded Windows 95 (32-Bit operating system).

InstigatorX wrote:
It's BEST to have 1 gig of extremely high qaulity RAM (think crucial ballistix, Muskin V-2, OCz platinum, G-Skill, HyperX) then 2 gig of moderate RAM.

Thinking in this mindset, where do you end up at?

:shock: IMO: I'm thinking you need to educate yourself...
put the crack pipe down...dam!
stop blowing smoke...one gig is better than two gigs of moderate RAM...my ass
why? so he can increase the pagefile size to the hard disk and slow his system down? justify your point without being so inconsistent with reason, logic, or common sense. :roll:


....moreover, does low CAS latency really matter? :idea:

The truth is that much of how CAS Latency effects your PC depends upon the component make-up of your computer. Unless your system is up on the cutting edge of technology and you're pushing performance to the limit as some over-clockers do, it may have some relevance to viod your warranty.

for the cost of almost doubling the price of Value RAM, I doubt that anyone will see the :idea:three percent :idea: increase in overall system performance.
In the real world, for you to notice this difference in CAS 3.0 vs CAS 2.0, one would have to benchmark.

let's take a quick look at the issue of memory timing by itself.....decide if it's worth the premium
Image
CAS 3.0 (average RAM) to CAS 2.5 results in an improvement of just over 1% on the Athlon 64 platform
and just over 2% on the Pentium 4.

Image
There's another modest pickup going from CAS 2.5 to 2.0. Both systems were about 1% faster (LOL) on the Business Winstone suite moving from 3.0 to 2.5, and almost 2% more going from 2.5 to 2.0.
Note: that in none of these tests was the overall improvement from CAS 3.0 to 2.0 more than 3%.

RAM manufacturers make it sound like CAS 2.0 is a huge improvement over CAS 3.0.

I rest my CAS... :P
Dave


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2005 5:47 am 
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WOW Dave very interesting stuff there!

For the record the Crucial Value Select is CAS 2.5


I do not do much with Photo shop but I am a gammer and game performance is important to me. I have found the "high performance memory" is really only an advantage if you plan to OC. Does anyone have any Becnhys with 1 gig vs 2?

Kevin


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2005 8:05 am 
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I think people are overthinking your question. You mentioned that you could use the cash from returning the RAM and going with 1g. Go ahead and do the switch and get your cash back.

Down the line if you find that you could benefit from another gig (which isn't likely for a casual user), then begin to save again land ook at adding another 1g. ValueRAM is not particularly expensive in the realm of PC components.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2005 11:30 am 
Willamette
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daveyd wrote:
In the screenshot, Photoshop was the only memory intensive app running.


And when you say editing, do you mean rendering? What exactly were you doing to kill your physical RAM and your pagefile? I have been unable to reproduce your results on my system and I only have one gig of RAM.

I had DOOM3, Half-Life 2, Paint Shop Pro (editing my own .TIFF image btw) Microsoft Outlook, Internet Explorer, Zone Alarm, Steam, MS AntiSpyware, Norton Internet Securities, and Norton Antivirus (to to mention all of thier processes) all running at the same time. My page file was only at 468 MB. Very strange indeed. Let's see a screenshot with what you stated, but this time with us able to see the current processes and apps running, not merely having you tell us about them.

You can see mine here (at the bottomare all my apps and progs). I was running two of the most CPU, graphic and memory intensive games known to mankind. So, it sounds like you have a leak or your not being fully kosher.

Quote:
Who are you trying to BS?


I was just asking you the same thing...

Quote:
Kevin has a 64bit proc. With the arrival of Windows' 64 bitOS coming out next month , it would be advisable to keep the 2 gigs of Crucial value ram.
computing was contorted, slow and buggy, it could well perform the type of tasks that were feasible on the amounts of RAM that were affordable in those days. We're talking about 2-16MB. Try running that RAM on an upgraded Windows 95 operating system.


duh. So your saying one gig of high quality RAM isn't sufficient? Uh...why? It's just not true. Maybe not sufficient for a professional graphic designer, video editor, or most enthusiasts. But you seem to be forgetting we are referring to a general user here...Regardless, one gig of quality RAM is sufficient for almost anyone.

Quote:
why? so he can increase the pagefile size to the hard disk and slow his system down? justify your point without being so inconsistent with reason, logic, or common sense.


I am not saying he shouldn't have two gig RAM. I was just saying for performance it should Dual Channel and quality. His crucial is "value" RAM, but it has great performance, it's quality RAM. I am simply saying "HE DOSENT NEED 2 gigs of RAM when his money is better spent elsewhere".

At the worst, he could send back 2 gigs and keep 2 gigs. (Although he dosen't necessarily need 2 gig).

And for the record, quality DUAL Channel ram does make a very large difference, sometimes almost 100% which you will not get from single channel, shitty RAM. That was my whole point. But your information was interesting, with manufacturers playing up CAS as clever marketing. In either instance, I would still prefer to have 2-2-2-7 on an AMD system as opposed to 3-4-3-4...wouldn't you?


Last edited by InstigatorX on Sat Mar 12, 2005 2:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2005 12:18 pm 
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One4yu2c wrote:
I think people are overthinking your question. You mentioned that you could use the cash from returning the RAM and going with 1g. Go ahead and do the switch and get your cash back.

Down the line if you find that you could benefit from another gig (which isn't likely for a casual user), then begin to save again land ook at adding another 1g. ValueRAM is not particularly expensive in the realm of PC components.


My pc is used for editing pics, gaming, web browsing, editing video or file sharing once in a blue moon.

The demend for RAM depends on the type of applications being used. A second gig of RAM could be called upon anytime when need be, most especially when you dealing heavily with editing video, CAD, gaming, database, and music or image editing programs. It's better to have the ram available, than to have Windows request for "virtual memory," which is your hard disk. When this happens, your systems starts to drag, often times the app will hang.
Moreover, the PC gaming industry continues to thirve with a more cinematic expierence. The size of their apps are forever increasing, they are now being sold on DVD disks.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2005 1:01 pm 
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daveyd wrote:
My pc...


We're talking about TechnoWeenie's PC, not daveyd's.

If his system ever needed more than one gig and started to drag (which would either never happen in his case or on very rare occassions), it would be quite noticeable. Then and only then should he look at dropping funds on additional RAM, as it's one of the most simple and attainable upgrades to perform - keep in mind he stated he could use the cash at this point in time.

To each his own, but I completely disagree in recommending 2gigs to a casual user whom is having a hard time justifying an accidental purchase. If TechnoWeenie would like to test this for himself, he could use the system for a week on 2gigs, then remove two of the sticks and use the system for another week with 1gig. At such time he can make a case for himself whether the 'difference' is justified and render this thread moot. Like I said, y'all are overthinking this...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2005 2:07 pm 
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One4yu2c wrote:
but I completely disagree in recommending 2gigs to a casual user whom is having a hard time justifying an accidental purchase. If TechnoWeenie would like to test this for himself, he could use the system for a week on 2gigs, then remove two of the sticks and use the system for another week with 1gig. At such time he can make a case for himself whether the 'difference' is justified and render this thread moot. Like I said, y'all are overthinking this...


Exactly. Daveyd has made his point known, but I think he is referring to HIS pc more then Technoweenie's (crazy name btw). I was thinking more along Techno's lines and that's simply why I disagreed with Daveyd and stated he only needed one gig of RAM.

I still stick by reccomending quality RAM, as opposed to off branded, high latency RAM. Does latency matter? A little, but not as much as the marketing gurus would have us believe. But does quality RAM fabrication matter? Oh yes, which is why I will countinue offering only the best RAM from the best companies. And if it just so happens they also have excellent low latencies, more power to them.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2005 1:55 am 
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Quote:
Dave

does low CAS latency really matter? :idea:

RAM manufacturers make it sound like CAS 2.0 is a huge improvement over CAS 3.0.




My VAIO desktop PCV RZ 46G came with one gigabyte of memory which suits my system well for some editing software. However, when it comes to using Photoshop CS, the hard disk gets overworked, and has left me having to wait considerably.
As a busy photographer, I need to spend as little time as possible editing each image in order to speed up the workflow. My key to streamline work is dependent upon this application with its automated batch-processing of RAW files. Consequently, the information you provided about CAS latency has given me an advantage when I made my purchase.
As a result, I saved $184.00, plus the speed of batch-processing is remarkable! This has been something very important to me and I can't thank you enough.

Sincerely,

R. Menuez

Quote:
instigatorX
I have been unable to reproduce your results on my system and I only have one gig of RAM.

I had DOOM3, Half-Life 2, Paint Shop Pro (editing my own .TIFF image btw) Microsoft Outlook, Internet Explorer, Zone Alarm, Steam, MS AntiSpyware, Norton Internet Securities, and Norton Antivirus (to to mention all of thier processes) all running at the same time. My page file was only at 468 MB. Very strange indeed. Let's see a screenshot with what you stated, but this time with us able to see the current processes and apps running, not merely having you tell us about them.

Technoweenie's (crazy name btw)




What makes you think that you're going reproduce daveyd's pagefile with only one gig of memory?

Are you're having difficulty reading his post? Why don't you have Photoshop running?


Quote:
InstigatorX wrote:
It's BEST to have 1 gig of extremely high qaulity RAM (think crucial ballistix, Muskin V-2, OCz platinum, G-Skill, HyperX) then 2 gig of moderate RAM.

Thinking in this mindset, where do you end up at?


No it's not. I just upgraded my ram to two gigabytes. However, you're making a fool out of yourself. The "quality" of your replies have little significance if you can't give him the numbers.

You tell techno this:
Quote:
And, when you need more, buy another gig of the high performance RAM. So instead of having two gigs of crap, you'll have two gigs of stuff that is much faster.


and then you come back to say this?
Quote:
His crucial is "value" RAM, but it has great performance, it's quality RAM.


make up your mind, you're confusing everyone.
With a name like instigatorX, you must be anticipating the consequences.

Real knowledge is to know the extent of one's ignorance. I find that nothing in the world is more dangerous than conscientious stupidity.

Is this what you're trying to reproduce?
Image

Let's see if we can provide some benchmarks with one gig vs. two

Sincerely,
R. Menuez


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2005 6:15 am 
8086
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Well I am glad you like tha name! LOL I need to make one corection it is "Corsair Value Select" I inadvertnently said Crucial. I have no clue what the memory timming is I only know it is CAS 2.5.

This has been a VERY interesting thread to follow both side have good points.

One question I have is how will 1 gig of "quality ram" benifit me more then the Corsair Value Select I have now?


Kevin


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2005 6:27 am 
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TechnoWeenie wrote:
One question I have is how will 1 gig of "quality ram" benifit me more then the Corsair Value Select I have now?


If you are not overclocking, then no. Low timed enthusiast RAM is geared towards:

1) The overclocker and
2) The enthsusiast looking to squeeze out every last drop of performance, noticeable or not, with little regard towards a price/performance ratio

I don't get the feeling you fall into either category, and getting CAS 2.5 (such as the Corsair) is a good compromise between enthusiast and value oriented. Or, take advantage of Newegg's deal on Kingmax and pick up a gig for less than $100 - Link

EDIT: As a side note (whether dealing with this thread or others), be weary of posts such as EOS1DS's. 'Coincidentally' his join date is today, it's his very first post, and he's immediately attacking InstigatorX in the same manner as daveyd. There's a good chance that's either a second account just opened up to try and get some backing, or a friend of his. In any event, both of them are describing their needs and not yours. :wink:


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