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 Post subject: 2 questions.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 06, 2005 10:37 pm 
Little Foot
Little Foot

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 12:51 pm
Posts: 127
Location: Atlanta
My friend has an abit k8n MB with 3400 proc. He bought an after market hsf, I believe a coolermaster. He triend oc'ing it. I belive he got it to 2.54 ghz where he saw temp increase. He said it stayed stable for about 2 days. Well he went into cs1.6(not a stressful game by todays standards) and he was getting 100 fps, then after 20 minutes it dropped to below 20 fps. He restarted, put everything back to stock, and he still cant manage over 25 fps. What do you think he f'd up? I put my money on ram, but I am still rather nubbish when it comes to oc'ing (cause i am too sissy to ty it with my baby). FYI he has a 6800gt, 512 meg xms pc3200 kingston ram. Not sure what else might be cause. Thanks in advance.

For my second question. I have an old server tower that my friend gave me a while back, and I run my system in that. Unfortuately the 120 intake, the 92 exhaust, and the 4 other 80 fans, not to metion the hsf get a little overwhelming sometimes. So I was looking at water cooling. I saw a pretty inexpensive system from thermaltake, the BigWater system. Looks pretty cool. Do you guys have any opinions on these. Keep in mind, I am not going to OC, I just want a stable computer, and test the water (no pun intended) of watercooling. Is this a good starters kit for me?

Thanks you guys
Jonathan


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 Post subject: Re: 2 questions.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 06, 2005 11:48 pm 
Celeron
Celeron
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Joined: Fri Jun 25, 2004 7:13 pm
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Location: New York City
swanysto wrote:
My friend has an abit k8n MB with 3400 proc. He bought an after market hsf, I believe a coolermaster. He triend oc'ing it. I belive he got it to 2.54 ghz where he saw temp increase. He said it stayed stable for about 2 days. Well he went into cs1.6(not a stressful game by todays standards) and he was getting 100 fps, then after 20 minutes it dropped to below 20 fps. He restarted, put everything back to stock, and he still cant manage over 25 fps. What do you think he f'd up? I put my money on ram, but I am still rather nubbish when it comes to oc'ing (cause i am too sissy to ty it with my baby). FYI he has a 6800gt, 512 meg xms pc3200 kingston ram. Not sure what else might be cause. Thanks in advance.


-Did anything happen with the 6800GT? I'm not sure if the card would work, but did the power connector to the card come loose? Check the internals of the PC.
-Is the graphics card actually overheating and causing it to throttle down? Check its temperatures. The card might not be getting enough airflow.
-Lastly, check to see if the AGP aperture size is at least 64MB. (doubt it's the problem)

I can't imagine this being a CPU problem, unless it's being underclocked.

swanysto wrote:
For my second question. I have an old server tower that my friend gave me a while back, and I run my system in that. Unfortuately the 120 intake, the 92 exhaust, and the 4 other 80 fans, not to metion the hsf get a little overwhelming sometimes. So I was looking at water cooling. I saw a pretty inexpensive system from thermaltake, the BigWater system. Looks pretty cool. Do you guys have any opinions on these. Keep in mind, I am not going to OC, I just want a stable computer, and test the water (no pun intended) of watercooling. Is this a good starters kit for me?

Thanks you guys
Jonathan


I dunno, but Koolance setups look good for easy setups. I'd also consider the Zalman doo-hickey. I'll leave it up to my superior, Chumly, for this one. ;)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Feb 07, 2005 9:05 am 
Little Foot
Little Foot

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 12:51 pm
Posts: 127
Location: Atlanta
well i dont think it is the vidcard because he said it worked in his other system. He put all the bios back to stock, so I am assuming with a amd64 3400, a small underclock would not cause such low performance, I do not believe it is under clocked though. I have a feeling something is damaged. I dont know.

As for the koolance kits, they look nice, but the BigWater is only 150, the koolance kits cost a little bit too much for something that wont be used to overclock.

Thanks for the help
Jonathan


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Feb 08, 2005 3:26 pm 
Celeron
Celeron
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Location: New York City
swanysto wrote:
He put all the bios back to stock, so I am assuming with a amd64 3400, a small underclock would not cause such low performance, I do not believe it is under clocked though.


This is the difference from A64 to other processors. If the multiplier is set lower than stock, you will take a performance hit. That means the setting could be as low as 4x (or as low as the mobo will allow) and the processor could be running at 800MHz for all you care.

The A64s also include the cool-n-quiet feature that clocks the processor down whenever it's not at full-load. Make sure you turn this feature off, but I doubt this is the problem.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2005 1:39 am 
Boy in Black
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As far as the water goes, I'd simply suggest other starter kits. The bigwater IS pretty cheap and will do what you want to do...get into water cooling. What do they go for...$150? Not bad, but for another $50 you can get into larger names like Swiftech.
http://www.frozencpu.com/ex-wat-37.html
That's a 120mm kit, and they have a cheaper 80mm kit which would also do you well. Swiftech, makes some really great stuff for cooling and don't ask a whole lot of money for higher-tier cooling methods.

I've advised that DIY put-togethers are fine, but really may be a bit much to just jump into. To do it right, you'll either have to do a moderate amount of studying or just take someone's word on what to get and how to go about doing it. So, consider both fields and remember that the forum is always here if you want to go DIY and need some advise...but the thought of opening a box and have all your stuff right there for the project is just dreamy!

Every DIY I do, I run into snags here and there. I don't mind because this is fun for me to figure out a cure, and in the end works better in most cases. But these snags may come off as heartbreaks and ruin the fun in a project pretty quick to others.

What snags could you run into? I have one pick that points out 3 snags I hit right off the bat this fall. Refer to this pic real quick and I'll point 'em out:
Image
First, I had measured the rear area that holds the stacker's 120mm fan carefully. From specs all over the place, the BlackIce Extreme radiator would fit right in there. I even wrote and bugged distributers for an actual measurement of the product. I got it, and it didn't fit. So...I couldn't push air out like I had planned and had to hang it off the fan as it was designed to be. This changed my entire layout. It put the rad way out over the CPU making the first turn into the block a quick double 90-degree S-turn one. I thought that just wouldn't cut it, but some good Parker Parflex tubing made the bends without kinking. It also wasn't the way I wanted it to look.

This also caused another problem. See the red arrows? That's bad. The TDX uses springs on all 4 corners to keep the block level with the CPU and not applying too much pressure. I couldn't use all four anymore and my jaw dropped when I was doing the final fitting. I had to chop off 2 of the posts and ditch those 2 springs. And to ensure I didn't over-tighten the brass nobs, I had to borrow a special torque wrench socket from my buddy at my last job and follow Intel's whitepapers on the applied pressures (or something like that). Tighten the solid mounts pulls up on the spring side. I had to dance with the thing for a while before it reached a happy spot. THEN took the measurement of the spring side and the torque readings on the solid side, took it apart, and do it again after an external wet-run and then the application of the thermal compound. Ya...it took a while just because that stupid rad was 1/32" too wide.

The pink points to empty fitting holes. It came with DD nylon fittings, but I wanted more, So I tossed 'em. Well, nothing else worked as well as those fittings do as all the brass out there was just too restrictive. I had to re-order those things to get my by until lately I found a local Parker shop that hooked me up with some great highflow fittings (that cost way too damned much). I wouldn't have gone on a 3 month fitting turkey hunt with a kit...or wasn't so picky.

And with all this, I did the orange circle. Fitting and re-fitting abuses your stuff. I dinged the fins on the rad when it fell. That could have turned bad, but it didn't do more than bend over the fins. Just a butt-hair from hitting a cross-tube though. I about cried, but got 'em straight anyway. But I instantly ran and found that grill for the radiator to wear during the rest of the build (I took it off after it was officially up and going).

Moral? Kits are sweet if you don't have patience or want to bother too much about alot of the troubles you can run across in DIY's.

Oh ya...my MOM bought that waterblock for me for Christmas. I have no idea where she knew what to get and what I had, but one of my friends must have been a mole. Either that, or she watched where I was spending money (she's the pres of my bank) and contacted them. Dunno...but it's still a mystery how in the hell that lovely lady knew exactly what I needed! She won't give up the how's and why's...she's more quiet than an NSA agent :p


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2005 8:56 pm 
Little Foot
Little Foot

Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 12:51 pm
Posts: 127
Location: Atlanta
you have an awesome mom!

Thanks for the suggestions. I have been reading a bit here, and on some other sites about watercooling. Im learning little by little. I like the idea of the swiftech you mentioned. I have heard good things about them.

As far going with kits; I like that idea cause being as this would be my first time, and I dont do a whole lot of modding, I would like for my first time to go somewhat smooth. I was thinking that way, I could get into it fairly inexpensive, and then start replacing parts one by one when I get really confortable with watercooling.

I am sure when I do (hopefully soon here) I willbe here to get help.

Thanks again
Jonathan


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 09, 2005 11:25 pm 
Boy in Black
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Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2004 1:40 pm
Posts: 24373
Location: South of heaven
And we'll be here waiting! Keep it real 8)


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