Quad-core, you're So HOT!
Posted 05/31/07 at 05:05:49PM | by  

Paul "One4yu2c" Lilly

Life is about perks, whether it's getting free HBO as a DirecTV installer, or taking the summer off because you went into teaching for your profession. I don't get either of these, but I do get to play with the latest computer gadgets and hardware. Most recently, I logged some hands-on time with Antec's P182 enclosure, the newest mid-tower in their Performance One series, and it got me wondering about the future of PC case design.

PC enclosures have a knack for avoiding major innovation, partly because the ATX specification continues to dominate the landscape, and has been doing so for the past decade. Intel's BTX form factor tried to shake things up, but was ultimately rejected by the DIY community from a presumed lack of necessity. And for the most part I agree, but how much longer will that stay true?

Using the above mentioned P182, I officially retired my AMD 4400+ X2 based system this past weekend, and in its place, I built a rig around Intel's newly released Core 2 Extreme QX6800 processor. This quad-core beast packs 2.93GHz in each of its four cores, sports a total of 8MB L2 cache, and comes topped off with an unlocked multiplier to feed my overclocking jones. In other words, it brings the heat...both literally, and figuratively. And adding to the thermals are a pair of 8800GTS videocards for some SLIick gaming performance. I had no expectations of a cool running rig, but will admit to being surprised at just how toasty things were getting under the hood.

On stock voltage and clockspeed, my temperature monitoring programs registered right around 50c idle, and just a tick under 70C during load (4 instances of CPU Burn-In). And that was after performing my cooling kung-fu. Arctic Silver 5 thermal paste? Check. Aftermarket heatsink/fan? Check (Thermaltake V1). Open the bedroom window to keep an influx of cool breeze flowing in, record temps in the evening, and remount the heatsink? Check, check, and checkmate. The underlying problem here is a hot running four-core chip combined with a chassis that lacks the cooling pizzaz needed for an enthusiast level rig. The P182 (whose forte is noise management) isn't alone in this category, and it even brings some handy cable routing options to help with airflow, but it's just not enough for where systems are headed. We saw dual-core chips become a standard option this past year, and widespread quad-core adoptance is approaching. Word on the street is that by mid summer, budget shoppers will be able to pick up a Q6600 for as low as $266. And Barcelona's knocking on the door.

Unlike with videocards, both Intel and AMD should be commended for putting thermal management at the forefront of chip design (lower wattage requirements, clockspeed throttling), and in preparation for the upcoming four core madness, I'd like to see more case manufacturers step up to the plate with effective cooling innovations too. I've seen a small handful of enclosures sporting giant 25cm side fans, which I'm more keen on than the ones that implement side ducts, and of course there's cases like the Cooler Master Stacker 830 with more fans than an Atlanta Hawks game. But let's see what else the case designing gurus can come up with. Otherwise, it's strictly up to consumers to figure out adequate cooling for high end setups, and our ideas tend to revolve around the outlandish (check out what you can do with 8 gallons of cooking oil). It's no easy task turning a hot rig into a cool running PC, something enthusiasts have known for years, and the mainstream may soon find out.

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Comments

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Cooling
Submitted by DreadedOne509 on Thu, 2007-05-31 15:51.

What was your rooms ambient temps during testing
and what else did you have running in that system
a toaster?

Ambient Temps
Submitted by One4yu2c on Thu, 2007-05-31 18:50.

Ambient temp was roughly 70F (about 21C), and as mentioned, there was a fairly constant breeze blowing in from the open window.

I'll eventually be ditching this P182 case, possibly going back to my Lian-Li PC-777B chassis. I'm just not in love with the P1xx design, and it's better suited for those that value acoustics over high thermal performance. When/if I do make the switch, I'll add a comment with updated temp readings.

Lian-Li PC-777B
Submitted by Gigahertz17 on Fri, 2007-06-01 12:00.

Lian-Li PC-777B? God that thing is hideous. It looks like a snail or something with that design.

I'm going to build a new computer here soon and I'm having the hardest time finding a good solid quiet case. I've been really looking at the Antec P182 but everybody says its hard to build in and gets really hot inside.

What case would you recommend for a good quiet high thermal performance case then? Lian-Li makes some great case but they are expensive. I'm looking for one under $200.

Case and Temp Monitoring Programs
Submitted by One4yu2c on Fri, 2007-06-01 13:51.

To Gigahertz: The P182 is a decent case and definitely improves upon the cable management nightmare that was the P180, I'm just not in love with the overall design. If you're looking for a good cooling and quiet case, the Antec 900 does a great job. It uses the same TriCool fans as the P182, and with them set to medium, you get a nice balance of air flow and noise control. The downside to the 900 is a lack of fan filters, so if you live in a dusty environment or own pets, you may want to mod some of your own.

Another alternative would be the new version of Thermaltake Armor with a 25cm side fan.

To statewd: Both Core Temp and ITAT (Intel Thermal Analysis Tool) are free temp monitoring programs. And of course there's software suites such as SpeedFan, SiSoft Sandra Lite, and Everest (free version) that come with additional functionality beyond temp reporting.

how hot can you go?
Submitted by ~gunslinger on Sun, 2007-06-03 07:01.

I just bought the P182 for my new system using a Q6600, Corsair Dominator ram, and MSI P6N mainboard. I was hoping to overclock it a bit, but now I am worried that the case isn't going to cool it down enough. I was just wondering how hot can the CPU get before instability occurs. BTW, I'm using the same CPU cooler as you.

Hot Hot?
Submitted by One4yu2c on Sun, 2007-06-03 10:27.

That's kind of a loaded question. Technically, Intel rates the Q6600's thermal specification at 62.2C, and ideally you want to avoid going over that. The problem here is how and where the temperatures are being measured, as two different programs can give two very different temperature readings.

What I would recommend (and this represents just my opinion) is to monitor your temps with Core Temp. Ideally you'd want to keep the four cores below 60C@load, with about 70ishC being my cutoff point where it becomes time to re-examine cooling.

And finally, take caution when installing the V1 into your P182. If you orient it so the fan blows air out the rear exhaust (which you should), then you'll run into some physical interference issues with the top mounted exhaust fan. There's a clip that rubs up against the fan preventing it from spinning, and I ended up bending the clip on mine to solve the problem. For a visual, go page two of THIS THREAD.

Thanks for the tips. I'm
Submitted by ~gunslinger on Sun, 2007-06-03 14:13.

Thanks for the tips. I'm going to overclock it carefully, I just want to squeeze about 200 MHz or so out of it. I should have it up and running by next weekend, so I'll try to post up the results in the build/buy section of the forums.

FYI - I just temp tested my current system using Everest. My comp uses dual Athlon 2800 MPs and a ATI Radeon 850 Pro. The cpu is running at 172 F, the motherboard at 171 F, and the GPU at 118 F. And this is at idle. Its not overclocked and I've really never had a stability problem with the system. Kinda crazy temps when compared what Intel recommends for their processors.

Temps
Submitted by One4yu2c on Sun, 2007-06-03 15:05.

Ya, older processors and most modern GPUs tend to run comparatively hot, particularly GPUs. I'd be a bit concerned at that motherboard temp though, assuming it's accurate. 77C seems awfully high for your motherboard's/case's ambient temperature.

temp monitoring software
Submitted by statewd on Fri, 2007-06-01 12:36.

Where can I get some good temperature monitoring programs? Any free ones on the 'net?

Thanks.

Ben

CPU temps
Submitted by horzo on Mon, 2007-10-01 10:03.

Keep in mind that many motherboards (particularly those with the Nvidia 680i chipset) read CPU temps incorrectly - at least partially. If your monitoring software shows CPU temp higher than core temp, you're likely encountering false readings. See this Nvidia forum thread for more info.. http://forums.nvidia.com/index.php?showtopic=44642

BTW, I'm very happy with my Antec P180. Cable management wasn't actually that challenging, and my thermals are entirely acceptable with the top two fans on low. Ahh...blessed silence!

Ok ok. I'm not overclocking and only running one video card, but just be aware that spending $200 on a case is silly unless you're planning to really push the thermal envelope.

Monster Mods
Submitted by filmjr on Sat, 2007-11-24 08:41.

These guys have a near-futureproof plan:

http://www.monstermods.com

Hard to imagine what such a setup couldn't cool.

Thank You Intel
Submitted by magneticvaportrail on Sat, 2007-12-01 18:50.

Worth every penny, system is twice as fast, and you do not need a benchmark program to see the difference. It's like moving from dial up phone modem to broadband.

Running 44-50 C without polishing (cleaning with solvent, ((2 lazy to donn the respirator)) the heatsink or chip out of the box (stock cooler) running at idle. Did some reading and saw that Intel chips can run without a heatsink without frying (would not recommend though, do not attempt with AMD) LOL.

Seriously, dropped the chip down to 100 Mhz and the temps dropped to 38-40 C. Not that paranoid though and set the voltage back to "auto", anything under 60 C is cool enough?

I will end up spending more for the (good) power supply and case than the chip? I'll upgrade the case to an aluminum one as the budget permits, since the motherboard is basically sitting on a steel "baking plate" (LOL)?

Thanks Intel! Seal the packages with Argon to preserve the surfaces from atmospheric interaction before installation?

(Signature) Thoughts for the day:

Drugs don't hurt, they kill (life, dreams, relationships, moods, etc.). Sex is designed to be more powerful than greed, use with extreme caution!



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