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PC + Digital Cable = Not Ready for Prime Time
Posted 06/07/07 at 01:35:36 PM by Michael Brown
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HOW WE TESTED
Our office building is serviced by satellite TV, not cable, so we decided to test the TV Wonder Digital Cable Tuners in my downtown San Francisco apartment. And since the product was so new to the market, we decided to contact Comcast’s public relations department (Comcast is our local cable provider) about delivering and installing the necessary CableCards. (The FCC mandates that the cable companies give consumers an alternative to renting a set-top box, but they didn’t say the cable companies couldn’t insist on installing it for you, making a few bucks off the service call, and charging you a modest rental fee to boot.)
I don’t know about you, but the idea of having Larry the Cable Guy hollering “Git-r-done!” while futzing around with my $7,000 home-theater PC scares the crap out of me. Fortunately, the technician Comcast dispatched turned out to be very experienced with PCs. He was, in fact, a Maximum PC reader who had built several of his own rigs. But let’s face it, a PC-savvy cable installer is not the norm. You’re more likely to get an independent contractor whose experience is limited to stripping and terminating coax.
So I either lucked out or Comcast’s PR department hand-picked the tech. The PR department, however, failed to inform the tech that I needed to install two PCs with a total of four TV Wonder cards, so he showed up with only two CableCards. And then he wanted to know where the OCUR boxes were. “The tuners are inside the PCs,” I said. “Really? I haven’t seen that before,” he replied. “I’ve only connected two PCs to cable, and they both used external boxes.”
You'll need a CableCard from your service provider to make an OCUR card work.
The tech told me he’d receive training direct from Microsoft, but none of it covered internal tuners. We both agreed that the process should be the same, since the only difference is that the slots are inside the case, versus in an external box. The tech then proceeds to install the CableCards, connect the tuners to coax line, fire up the PC, and begin the software configuration. This step involves activating the TV Wonder with a product-activation code, and calling the Comcast office to exchange some information.
We should have had a picture at this point, but we didn’t. After double-checking all his connections, running diagnostics on the cable itself, and conferring with the home office, the tech decides to call his contact at Microsoft who had personally trained him how to install external OCUR boxes. And this is when the installation process went from absurd to ridiculous—especially since the tech—unbeknownst to the people he was speaking to—had his push-to-talk cellphone on speaker.
Did you try Vista Media Center's TV Pack?
Submitted by Talk to me Goose on Sun, 08/17/2008 - 2:33am
Although a complete hassle to install. This might get the cable cards working.
Just use your Cable Box
Submitted by beef_wellington on Sat, 04/05/2008 - 2:00pm
I've got a Motorola DCT6416 and there are drivers available so you can utilize the Firewire port. Your PC will pick it up as a TVtuner device and it's $14 a month from your cable provider. Check this link http://thegreenbutton.com/forums/post/154082.aspx It's little bit complicated but it seems to work.
Digital cable
Submitted by docsharp01 on Fri, 03/07/2008 - 7:19am
Excellent article and comments.
I think cable television is becoming extinct and will eventually be replaced by satellite TV which is becoming the norm, especially in locales outside the United States.
Submitted by Black Falcon on Mon, 07/30/2007 - 5:52pm
Couldn't you just order the cheapest HTPC with an OCUR card and swap it into the next PC you build yourself? Then again what's the point if the card isn't worth the space it takes up?
Submitted by WScottCross on Mon, 07/23/2007 - 12:35pm
I actually have a working Cablecard system from Velocity Micro. It wasn't completely without pain (one failed DCT and DCT shortage at VM) but it is working fine now and once I realized that my problem with XBOX360 extender failing was due to wireless card drivers it is even better. The cablecard install actually went pretty well once they found someone at Comcast who was able to authorize my cablecards.
Folding in memory of Sharon Sharp (9/21/47-5/16/05)
Submitted by NuttyNut on Sat, 07/21/2007 - 10:12pm
For those who loves to bash Comcast, I bet you have never work with cable card, know what OCUR is, or have a clue what's involve in getting everything involved (media PC hardware, OS, drivers, and cable card.) working properly with each other; so pipe up and go crawl back under the rock you came from.
Submitted by bountycode on Mon, 07/02/2007 - 7:19am
The web link in the Maximum PC mag is incorrectly stated as
www.maximumpc.com/articles/ocurit should be
http://www.maximumpc.com/article/ocur
Submitted by cmacnaug on Wed, 06/13/2007 - 8:57am
Hi Michael,
I had exactly the same problem! I even had the same comcast technician as you.
When I first received my system one of the internal DCTs wasn't showing up in the Network screen, I had to do some rewiring to get it to be recognized by the OS at all. It turned out later that it had older firmware (VM got this taken care of pretty quickly when the logged into my machine). After this hiccups I was in the same situation as you.
Velocity Micro S85 dual internal cablecards, Media Center simply wouldn't recognize them. I was really impressesd with the effort that comcast made to get this thing running ... they stayed at my apartment for 5 hours, and I had expected this treatment to be reserverd for the press. Velocity Micro's been pretty responsive as well, but between M$, AMD/ATI and Velocity Micro it is pretty hard to figure out where the problem lies. One problem is that until Media Center recognizes the cable cards, you can't get at the DCT diagnostic screens.
So here I am 7 weeks after ordering my system from VM with a $2800 box that doesn't work. I like these guys at VM, though, so I'll ride it out. Unfortunatley they are out of DCTs again so it looks like another (2+ week) round of waiting for cable card shipments for me. Then if that doesn't work I'll be waiting for VM to ship me an entirely new system.
Submitted by MceUser on Mon, 06/11/2007 - 8:28am
The command you mentioned is incorrect (apart from the slashes). If you look close enough, you will notice there is no such file as ehribjob.exe in the location. You are probably looking for ehprivjob.exe. And the parameter is incorrect as well.
Submitted by dharkfiber on Mon, 06/11/2007 - 6:10am
I think I may get a subscription again instead of "shelf-browsing" the issues.
Submitted by Dersimli on Wed, 11/05/2008 - 2:34pm
Here’s a little background if you’re not familiar with OCUR. Following an FCC mandate, cable companies must now allow their customers to access their oyun services using third-party equipment, as opposed to forcing them to rent a set-top box from the service provider.
Submitted by bosunj on Sat, 06/09/2007 - 6:18pm
dedgar stated:
"Lately it seems that no matter what they try to do, it just isn't quite right."
Duh, YEAH!!!
But then again, what aspect of the American experience isn't thus infected??? Be honest with yourself.....
Submitted by pcfxer on Sat, 06/09/2007 - 4:55pm
Why can't we blame Microsoft? Microsoft wants Vista to corner the market with media and digital entertainment-think Apple. Anyhow, it is quite possible to shut Hollywood up. Open source OS's scratch for Linux have been shutting up folks who don't play nice with them.
No blob? No support, BAM! No GPL-released code? See ya! Not secure? PEACE OUT!
The same can be done with Hollywood? You expect Grandpa to shell out $1000+ for something that he can maybe use. It's just silly. I have been trying, on the cheap, to get a PC into the living room and it is "do-able" but with issues like this MS should just say, "Hey, this doesn't work, it isn't reliable and will DETRACT from the Vista experience. You are the weakest link! Goodbye."
It's as simple as that. Why is it any different if we record HD on a PVR? I can take my drive from a PVR and load the files onto my PC which is networked. PVRs are also bundling USB/Firewire/CAT5 connections as well. So the difference between an HTPC and a PVR is what? The OS? The PC can game/e-mail? Yet they both can provide access to unsolicited material in HD.
Submitted by cliftong on Sat, 06/09/2007 - 5:06am
Every new tech has it stumbling period but lately anything with DRM attached to it seems to have more than its fair share of mess-ups. I truly believe that the cable card concept was a good one until Hollywood got involved.
It seems like their mission in life is to punish people who actually pay for their products. Like for example the Tivo Series 3; why cant I use tivo-to-go like the Series 2. Why should I be penalized for purchasing a HDTV and paying extra for the HDTV package and pay extra for a HDTV PVR system but have less functionality than I do for using the standard def setup which is cheaper.
I don't know if these industries have a think tank somewhere that came up with the notion that if we abuse our paying customer so much they will take to the street like vigilantes and hunt down pirates. In the hopes that we will reward them some functionality of the content they already payed for.Not to promote piracy but it's a little sad and restarted that the "pirates" come out looking like the good guys in this.
RE: "DRM in my opinion is to blame."
Submitted by B5Freak on Sun, 06/10/2007 - 9:36am
This is pretty much 'preaching to the choir', don't you think? Anyone who's been a regular reader of MaxPC must know by now that DRM is a miserable failure. It causes more problems and doesn't solve any. Legitimate users lose functionality of the product they've legally acquired, and the pirates laugh in the face of the RIAA, MPAA and their like, break whatever DRM 'flavor of the week' is being used and keep pirating. To paraphrase SpazzAttack, the sooner DRM dies a sudden, horrific and nasty death, the better for all electronic entertainment content consumers.
Submitted by SpazzAttack on Sat, 06/09/2007 - 8:50am
I must concur with cliftong: This sounds to me like the cable cards are so locked-up with DRM crap that they won't function reliably, if at all. The sooner DRM collapses under its own porcine weight, the better.
Even though I would love to have a digital cable card in my PC, I will simply have to muddle through life as best I can without one. Forcing me to purchase a pre-built, over-priced, OEM system with crappy tech support just to grant me the blessing from the movie biz executives of watching digital cable TV on my own computer is a complete joke.
Submitted by malebolgia on Fri, 06/08/2007 - 2:53pm
Best article I've read in a long time, I had really hoped setting up OCUR wouldn't be such a nightmare. I hope for Microsoft's sake this gets cleared up ASAP (WMC is such a nice product).
Submitted by sc123 on Fri, 06/08/2007 - 8:29am
I commend you on controlling the urge to push the tech out of the way and work on the problem yourself.
Submitted by statewd on Thu, 06/07/2007 - 1:37pm
Will this feature (in its entirety) be in the August issue of MaxPC? Or in a shorter version?
Relationship between this story online and in print.
Submitted by MrMick on Thu, 06/07/2007 - 1:46pm
The feature story (a roundup of three HTPCs with a head-to-head section pitting the concept of the OCUR-outfitted HTPC against a TiVo Series 3) will appear in the August print issue. The online story will appear only on the website, but it will be referenced in the print story.
--mb
Submitted by wawa9ball on Thu, 06/07/2007 - 6:34pm
The cable tech said that he had tested the occur cards before coming over. I had read another article from somewhere else when they were testing the external digital cable wonder and the tech also tried to use a card that was working earlier. They failed also. The reason is that once a card has been used or tested or tried, it becomes married to whatever device it was first attempted with. Therefore it will not work on your system if the tech fired up the cablecard prior to installing at your location.
Most cable companies are money hungry beasts, so be sure to get your money back on the service call because more than likely, it was their fault that their cards would not work on your system because they were used (albeit for only a brief test).
Submitted by bholstege on Thu, 06/07/2007 - 12:11pm
That series of phone conversations was one of the funniest things I've heard in a long time.
Comcrap?
Submitted by big_montana on Thu, 06/07/2007 - 11:54am
No wonder you had problems, with Comcrap as your cable provider. Can't blame all the problems on Microsoft, AMD and PC vendors.
Submitted by MrMick on Thu, 06/07/2007 - 12:45pm
I didn't mean to imply that Comcast is free from fault in this fiasco; only that the Comcast technician struck me as being both competent and PC savvy.
--mb
Michael Brown
Executive Editor
Submitted by big_montana on Fri, 06/08/2007 - 5:21am
Then that is a first for a Comcast technician. I never met or spoken to anyone from Comcast that I could apply the term "competent" to. The best thing that could happed for Comcast customers, is for Comcast to go belly up.
Submitted by bland on Thu, 06/07/2007 - 11:46am
I think a big problem with new technologies is they make everything idiot proof and plug and play. Im not saying it's a bad thing, in fact it's very good, but the problem is when it does go wrong it's getting next to impossible to fix becuase they hide whats really going on in the background making it harder to dig out.
Submitted by soggybomb on Thu, 06/07/2007 - 10:56am
Its frustrating that things don't just work when you plug them in. Why can't people care enough to deliver a product that works as advertised?
Ya shudda known it weren't
Submitted by dedgar on Thu, 06/07/2007 - 9:55am
Ya shudda known it weren't gonna work. MS was involved. (snicker)
Lately it seems that no matter what they try to do, it just isn't quite right. I don't know if it's just 'too many fingers in the pie', left hand not talking to the right, or what.
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