Windows 8 Consumer Preview Goes Live

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JohnP

The REAL question is "Does AMD's Bulldozer chip now work 'properly' with this version of Windows 8"? AMD has been whining about how Win7 was not "optimized" for their chip. MS released some optimizations for Win7 that only helped a couple of percent in benchmarks. It will be interesting to see if AMD announces that this version of Windows 8 is also "broken".

Anyone heard if someone has run new benchmarks for Bulldozers with Win8 consumer preview?

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livebriand

If you want a useless computer, use Windows 8 in the metro UI. If you want to get things done and really multitask and such, and have an intuitive UI on the type of PC the vast vast vast majority of people have (desktop or laptop, keyboard and mouse, no touchscreen), the metro UI will be useless for you, a huge pointless mess, PLUS you have to go through the metro UI to get to the desktop. AND, without a start menu, the desktop is now even harder to use than ever before. Hell, you can't even shutdown the PC in an obvious way - you have to get back to metro (and from the desktop it's not obvious how you do that), click your username, logout, slide up the lock screen or whatever image, and THEN shutdown. On Windows 7, you click Start, Shutdown. Such an improvement, right? NOT!

Windows 8 is good on a tablet, but on a regular desktop or laptop with a keyboard and mouse, it's a big DOWNGRADE compared to Windows 7. I won't be upgrading to Windows 8, and I bet many other people won't either.

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Nachima

It has taken some time to get used to the "Metro" Interface the installed programs it does put on there can be unpinned and this helps unclutter it. I like the fact that almost everything like weather is right there and very informative @ that. I have used many operating systems and like many others they adapt with the times. I would normally not comment on products this early on but this deserves a "fair Shake" for usability and ingenuity. I think that with prolonged usage windows 8 will be just like windows 7 once users become familiar with it. These are only based on my usage and experiences, ultimately it is up to you the consumer to for there own opinion.

Best Regards,
Nachima

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Stars

If Win 8 shuts down Prg after you move away from them, what about a prg that you need to keep running while you do something else? Transcoding, All the @home stuff, things like that? Will Win 8 still do that or did it turn back into a single tasking OS?

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JohnP

Heh, after installed 30 programs or so, you should see the mess that is in the Metro screen. Roboform alone put in 6-7 boxes. Tune up utilities a good dozen, same with Office. So I can either leave them in Metro so when I click one one it immediately jumps into the desktop to run or just delete it from Metro and put it into True Launch bar (like quick toolbar on steroids).
Seems to boot slower than Win 8 Developer Preview, maybe 20% slower. Still faster than Win7 but not as fast as I was getting. Bummer.
Finding the charm pretty much useless along with Metro. I guess I will see if I can turn them both off.

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JLloyd13

I had a much easer time adapting to ubuntu the this. I can say it looks good for tablets... But on my main computer I wish I could turn metro off and switch back to good old areo. I can get to the desktop, but when I click the start button for my files it just dumps me back in to metro.

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pet789

my roomate's aunt makes $83/hr on the laptop. She has been without work for 8 months but last month her pay was $8682 just working on the laptop for a few hours. Read more on this site...Nuttyrich . com

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itzabo

Download 10 Min
Create Bootable USB drive 5 Min
Install 15 Min or so I got distracted.

I didn't have to do anything and all my hardware worked.
Logged into my live account.

It found my network and all my media was available.
Once again I did nothing and it worked!!

Installed Chrome, logged into to my google account
All of my plugins were there. Sweet!!!

Install K-Lite.
Watching robot chicken on monitor 2 while I explore on monitor 1
Sure it's different, But change is good sometimes.

Now I have to install Autocad. Probably won't be so lucky.

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Michael Ellis

I thought the developer preview sucked, but this takes the cake. They have managed to use Window 8 to cram every failed Ballmer project I can think of down the consumer's throat: Games for Windows, Hotmail, locked-down hardware, Metro UI (mustn't forget the success that's been in the mobile marketplace), hardware-based DRM, etc...

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mls067

magnet:?xt=urn:btih:EB0425E737E5EE2DA249B2BF920327660A984515&dn=Windows8-ConsumerPreview-64bit-English.iso&tr=udp%3a//tracker.publicbt.com%3a80/announce&ws=http%3a//iso.esd.microsoft.com/WCPDL/BD1B8A49393E30CC9C4E5C88457D73E964F1F3B18/Windows8-ConsumerPreview-64bit-English.iso

torrent download ;-)

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JohnP

Y'know, I wonder how magnet links are going to be viewed as they are not real links but just a bunch of text. Shoot with a little bit of encryption they would look totally meaningless. Probably why Pirate Bay just went exclusively to them (and they work fine in Vuze/Azerus).
BTW, to RUN the above magnet link, just copy it and paste it into the browser address bar.

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Charles-the-Great

Why did they remove they Window button? Also no classic start menu? Windows 8 will be the death of Microsoft. They got it right with Windows 7 but if they do not allow us to have a opinion that we can have the classic menu back then I will be switching to a Mac

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Engelsstaub

I don't really hate Windows so much. I understand why MS is trying to implement the Metro UI. It's basically an admission that many consumers are headed to that poorly-defined and misunderstood "Post-PC World."

...but it you decide it's not for you anymore then you are most welcome "over here." :)

I'm going to try it out. I try to stay on top of Windows and Linux even though I spend most of my time on a Macintosh. Most people who read MPC tend to lean towards gaming as a hobby. I lean more towards recording and music. (Video as well, but if it was just that Windows could probably have the edge IMO.) I find some of the tools available on this platform far more to my needs and liking. ...but I keep the Win7 box around for the occasional game.

If you decide you may want to switch platforms, don't let people bully you with their prejudices and BS. Only you know what's "right" for you.

One thing Windows 8 appears to be is bold. I'm passively interested in seeing how it all plays out.

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Neufeldt2002

Initial thoughts on using Win 8.

USELESS, absolutely USELESS. The desktop is unintuitive, it is by fluke that I found where to shutdown, (hover around the clock brings up a sidebar that has that and other options) and the only way to get out of an app is to use the windows or esc key. But that doesn't close it down, it only hides it. You have to CTRL ALT DELETE to bring up the task manager and then kill the process.

As is, I don't think I will be playing with this much more, as it is clearly designed for anything but the desktop.

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maxeeemum

Yes I agree!

Everybody should know that Cregan89 is a Software Developer that is creating apps for Windows 8. Basically a Microsoft employee! His lengthy comments should be ignored.

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TRxReFLeX

Agreed not for desktop gamers or anyone on a desktop

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Cregan89

I agree that a lot of the new interface features aren't obvious at all since they are hidden, and to access them you have to move your mouse or touch the screen edges. But it makes a lot of sense, they want to take the focus away from the UI and put the focus on the applications themselves, allowing them to use 100% of the available screen real-estate. I'd imagine that in Windows 8 RTM there will be some sort of tutorial displayed to first time users about the various screen edge features and gestures.

With that being said... To close the app you're currently in, you click and drag it from the top of the screen down to the bottom. To close an app suspended in the background, you move to either the top-left or bottom-left corners of the screen and move up or down and thumbnails of all your suspended app's come up (basically a Metro task bar), then just right click on a thumbnail and click 'Close'.

Although, the whole point of Metro is that you shouldn't have to worry about closing app's anyway. You let the OS handle your system resources because it can do a much better job then you can. If you go and open a bunch of Metro app's and then switch to the desktop and launch the task manager, you'll notice that all of your Metro app's are using literally zero system resources, unless they're running a background task. Continuously closing app's really just puts more stress on the system when you go to launch them again later, and for low powered devices this slows the system down, and in mobile devices this eats up more battery. It's the same thing in iOS and Android. Constantly closing applications actually decreases performance, not increase.

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livebriand

You work for Microsoft and have only tried using Windows 8 on a tablet, which most of us don't have, right?

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Neufeldt2002

"With that being said... To close the app you're currently in, you click and drag it from the top of the screen down to the bottom. To close an app suspended in the background, you move to either the top-left or bottom-left corners of the screen and move up or down and thumbnails of all your suspended app's come up (basically a Metro task bar), then just right click on a thumbnail and click 'Close'."

Sorry, I just don't see how that is more efficient than clicking on an "X" or clicking on exit.

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Citizen Snips

Honestly, this is exactly the same functionality that Mac OS has had for ages.

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Cregan89

I never said it was more efficient (although I don't see how it's any less efficient). But what IS more efficient is not having to close applications at all.

Metro is all about removing focus from the OS and it's UI, and putting the focus on the actual applications it's running. A key part to this is giving applications access to 100% of the screen real-estate.

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Neufeldt2002

And I hate the idea of giving any one app my entire screen. As far as Metro removing the focus of the UI, it failed IMO. Metro is so fugly to me it is a distraction that I don't ever want to see. I honestly gave it a try, but IMO MS failed with this one in a huge way.

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damicatz

How does making routine functions invisible and non-obvious to the average user make sense? It's not intuitive. If someone who is technically inclined like the OP can't figure it out at first glance, what chance does the average user?

Replacing the start button with...wait...an *invisible* start button makes even less sense. I mean, obviously the average user is going to know that the empty spot at the left corner of the screen is really a button.

"You let the OS handle your system resources because it can do a much better job then you can."

No it can't. Computers are never as good at resource management as humans are. Just compare C++ memory management to .net; yes the former is harder but it also has the potential to be far more efficient.

"Continuously closing app's really just puts more stress on the system when you go to launch them again later"

No it doesn't. Cache exists for a reason.

"low powered devices this slows the system down"

I don't care about low-powered devices. I represent the majority of the Windows user base who uses Windows on a PC. How many Windows 7 tablets do you see lying around? (And remember that Microsoft was touting Windows 7 as the best tablet operating system ever).

"It's the same thing in iOS and Android"

I'm using a PC not a smartphone. That should be the first clue that Windows 8 is a terrible design. Again, Windows users are PC users. Microsoft is alienating their core user base, relegating them to second-class citizens because they are trying to leverage their desktop operating system monopoly to take over the tablet market (illegal, by the way).

"Constantly closing applications actually decreases performance, not increase."

Where is your source for this information?

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Cregan89

I absolutely agree that these hidden screen edge gestures are (by design) not at all obvious. But because of this I expect Microsoft will include some sort of feature discovery tutorial the first time a user logs on in the Windows 8 RTM.

As far as system resources go, you have to realize that the Metro UI is a completely new application framework based off of more modern software design. Metro applications are inherently different then desktop applications (aka classical Windows applications). Desktop applications constantly run, even when they're minimized. The OS kernel is constantly scheduling time for every thread to run, and very rarely do threads fully hibernate in desktop applications. In Metro applications, when they are minimized, their threads are 100% frozen, so they take up zero processor time. Metro applications only have access to a very specific set of API's that they can run when in the background, and these API's are highly tuned for energy and CPU efficiency. The OS can also group all program calls to the same API together, allowing it to be even more efficient.

When you switch out of a Metro application, it's threads are frozen, and it's memory footprint essentially enters a CACHE mode. So when you force close Metro applications, you are removing it from cache essentially! Also, force closing Metro applications goes against the Metro principles to begin with. Metro applications are supposed to function as constantly running applications. You can switch between multiple applications but when you come back to the application, it's state resumes exactly from where it was previously. Force closing app's causes the app to loose it's state, ruining this always running appearance.

Also, when I say low-powered devices, I don't just mean tablets. I mean any battery powered PC. Desktop users don't represent the majority of the Windows user base. Laptops have outsold Desktop PC's since 2008. The majority of Windows users are on a battery powered device. And as a perfect example, the battery time on my ThinkPad has literally almost doubled today since I installed Windows 8 CP. And it's also surprisingly faster.

And that's why I think Windows 8 is awesome. I can get double the battery life on my notebook while reading and commenting on MaxPC, listening to music, checking my emails, but then switch over to the desktop and run my complete development environment. And that is exactly the point behind Windows 8. The best of all worlds. It's still the best for content creation, but now is the best for content consumption at the same time. You guys may hate it, but it just made my life a whole lot better...

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JohnP

K, downloaded the .iso, burned it, took a spare hard drive and loaded in Win8 consumer preview until I got to the metro screen and fooled around some.
1. You need the S/n first thing. Write it down before bothering to try to install.
2. only requires 2 reboots and about 20 minutes until 1st boot.
3. Make sure to have a Microsoft Live account set up and write down the password as it will ask you to log in along with your e-mail account, cell phone etc.
4. Enjoy the penrose tile styled fish as a loading screen. Don't ask me!
5. The windows key flip between the Metro interface and the desktop (or a running app).
6. How the freaking hell am I supposed to reboot the damn computer? the power key only shuts it down...

My first impressions are wildly mixed. Metro is much better designed than in the developer preview and the apps look and act professional.

However, the desktop has been completely emasculated and IT REALLY, REALLY SUCKS! There is no way on the desktop to pull up the control panel for instance, so how the hell do I make changes to settings? Mind you, I will have this cracked sooner rather than later but 1st impression for the desktop is bad.

The people who have been complaining about no start key have a completely valid point. How ordinary folks are to supposed to change setting without a lot of convoluted key stroking was not at all apparent in my initial assessment.

BOOO, Microsoft!

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Cregan89

Oh and the shut-down button is under the Settings Charm as well.

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Cregan89

John all of this stuff is now in the 'Charms Bar'.

Just move your mouse into either the top-right or bottom-right corners of the screen, then the Charms Bar will slide out. There's a 'Settings Charm' that is context sensitive to whatever app you are currently running.

So when you're on the desktop and you click on the Settings Charm you get the settings related to the desktop. One of these options being the Control Panel. My only complaint is that MS should definitely add the 'Computer Management' dialogue to this list.

The Control Panel in Windows 7 was 2 clicks away, and it's still only 2 clicks away in Windows 8 as well, so it's not any less efficient. It's just in a different location now, which is a little annoying, but it makes a lot of sense. The settings for all app's (including the desktop) are always in the same spot. It also get's system management type stuff out of the way and allows the desktop to be more focused at it's primary job... Launching and managing desktop applications.

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JohnP

Oh. You mean that I cannot rant and rave any more? Well, that is disappointing! I guess if I have actually READ some of the damn stuff or used it for more than 5 minutes, I MIGHT have figured this out on my own but what is the fun in that?
Meantime, I will be on the new version in a hour or so once I have my utilities folder moved over and back up my bookmarks and Outlook and Roboform. Should be fully up and running in about 3 hours or so.

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Cregan89

Haha yeah but I think it does bring up an important point though. These 'Screen Edge Gestures' are nice and all, and are effective at directing focus away from the OS and putting the focus on the applications themselves, but they are (by design) not obvious at all. Microsoft should definitely include a quick 'feature reveal' tutorial for new users in the Windows 8 RTM.

Btw, what browser do you use? I use Chrome and log in with my gmail account, so all of my bookmarks, history, etc. are synced over the cloud. I just installed Chrome on Windows 8 CP and logged in with my gmail account and Chrome configured itself exactly the same as before. It's the first time I've ever tried it and I was quite impressed, it made my migration significantly easier. I know some people aren't big fans of Google or the Cloud lol, but it really does make things so much easier. I think FireFox has a plugin that does something similar as well.

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JohnP

Cripes, I am an old hand at building a op sys from scratch. All my important utilities and critical backups are in two folders so by copying them over pretty much everything is ready to reinstall. Outlook pst, Roboform, True launch bar, Firefox profile, Quicken Home, Directory Opus, and password tracker deluxe settings are all backed up before I start a new build.
When you know where Firefox's profile is kept, a quick copy and replace will put Firefox back to EXACTLY the way that you had it before, passwords, settings, history, bookmarks, bookmark toolbar are all there. One simple copy and replace, takes 30 seconds. Same with Outlook, Roboform and the rest.
Once you have it figured out, it is just sit back, read a book and watch the installs take place 3 or 4 at a time.
4 hours and what 30 programs and 20 games all installed. Had dinner in the middle of that.

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hmp_goose

Is it the same registry switch to kill of that silly Metro?

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JohnP

NVM

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loozer

M$

Y U no have good download speeds?

I don't want to wait an hour for this iso to download. I could pirate windows 7 in less time!

On a serious note, the new start button icon looks really ugly.

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JohnP

took me less than 10 minutes to get the 3GB iso on technet.

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JohnP

Note that there are a bunch of different downloads for Microsoft TechNet subscribers with specific versions 32 bit and 64 bit along with bootable ISO files (There are two retail keys available that will allow up to 10 computers to use each key). I have a strong suspicion that since the TechNet have retail keys that these copies will NOT have a shelf life and will be good even after the official release. A TechNet subscription costs $199/year with a renewal costing $149/year.
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/subscriptions/default.aspx
Note: TechNet subscriptions are to be used for evaluation purposes only and once you have thoroughly evaluated the products you are required to purchase a normal license (End CYA blurb).

Windows 8 Consumer Preview WDK Web Installer (x86 and x64) - (English)
EXE|English|Release Date: 2/29/2012|Details
Product Keys
Download 0.672 MB
Windows 8 Consumer Preview WDK (x86 and x64) - (English)
ZIP|English|Release Date: 2/29/2012|Details
Product Keys
Download 329 MB
Windows 8 Consumer Preview WDF Co-installer (x86 and x64) - (English)
MSI|English|Release Date: 2/29/2012|Details
Product Keys
Download 24 MB
Windows 8 Consumer Preview SDK Web Installer (x86 and x64) - (English)
EXE|English|Release Date: 2/29/2012|Details
Product Keys
Download 0.685 MB
Windows 8 Consumer Preview SDK (x86 and x64) - (English)
ZIP|English|Release Date: 2/29/2012|Details
Product Keys
Download 296 MB
Windows 8 Consumer Preview Assessment and Deployment Kit Web Installer (x86 and x64) - (Multiple Languages)
EXE|Multiple Languages|Release Date: 2/29/2012|Details
Product Keys
Download 0.851 MB
Windows 8 Consumer Preview Assessment and Deployment Kit (x86 and x64) - (Multiple Languages)
ZIP|Multiple Languages|Release Date: 2/29/2012|Details
Product Keys
Download 1996 MB
Windows 8 Consumer Preview with Apps (x86) - DVD (English)
ISO|English|Release Date: 2/29/2012|Details
Product Keys
Download 2586 MB
Windows 8 Consumer Preview with Apps (x64) - DVD (English)
ISO|English|Release Date: 2/29/2012|Details
Product Keys
Download 3418 MB

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hmp_goose

[quote]I have a strong suspicion that since the TechNet have retail keys that these copies will NOT have a shelf life and will be good even after the official release.[/quote]
Pardon?

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JohnP

The FREE serial number that comes with the consumer preview will be good for a while then MS will turn it off. I am thinking that the Technet serial numbers will never be turned off. Since the preview is neither professional or home version, though, I am not sure about this.

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austin1789

I've got an extra machine that I'm going to load it onto and check out. During the initial setup, the only thing it griped about was my 64-Bit Cisco VPN client and (funny enough) Microsoft Security Essentials. Everything else passed. Considering the amount of programs loaded on this machine I'd say that's one positive so far.

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sammy_sam

Only one question: Did they forget about the business user again?

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Michael Ellis

Thank you......so much.

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bigrigross

I have the oddest issue with windows 8. It wont show my battery at all. It doesnt even state that I have a battery in device manager. It did the same thing with the developer preview when I went from the HDD (Showed the battery) to the SSD and then nothing said I had one. Weirdest issue yet. I love the 5 second boot time, but if I cant see my battery, whats the point.

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Cregan89

Be sure to file this bug with Microsoft. That is the point of a public beta after all.

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Sananelan

@bigrigross

I have the EXACT same issue, so annoying. Do you know how to fix it?

I uninstalled "Microsoft AC adapter" from Device Manager, rebooted and then the battery icon came back. But when I rebooted Again, it was gone.

If you find a solution, please let me know

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bigrigross

Yeah, I already filed a bug report. It was only after installing my SSD on the Developer Preview that it didnt show the battery. It was the oddest thing ever.

@Sananelan And I do think I found the solution, I have a Sandybridge i5 in my laptop and I downloaded drivermax which searches for outdated drivers. It found several but the one that fixed my battery issue was installing both the "2nd Generation Intel Core Processor family PCI Express Root Port" and the "2nd Generation Intel Core Processor family DRM Controller" drivers. It pulled them for me using Drivermax. Only sucky thing is is that it only lets you pull 2 drivers a day which will work. When I installed them both, the battery started to work after I restarted. Im not sure what either of those have to deal with the battery, but it worked.

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Sananelan

I updated the drivers using DriverMax, but when I reboot the problem exists. Sometimes it works if I delete the "Microsoft AC adapter" from device manager and reboot. But then it always disappears again after another reboot.

This is so annoying, I may go back to Win 7.

Any other solutions?

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bigrigross

You could try going into the registry and find the Microsoft AC thing and permanently delete it and see what happens. Is this happening to you on a sandybridge laptop? Or do you happen to have optimus on the laptop? Cause it could be those issues.

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georgey

MS still needs to tell desktop users why we should care about Windows 8.

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Cregan89

They've given a whole bunch:
http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/

Not to mention, despite common misconception, the Metro interface works perfectly fine on a desktop as well...

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Michael Ellis

Define "works."

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