WikiLeaks Encounters Hosting Trouble

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carage

So if the movies we watch have any factual basis at all, why don't we send [insert action hero name] to pay him or his son a visit? I'm pretty sure CIA/NSA/PMC still have wet job units.

I don't see how this can't be solved with a well placed sniper bullet or C4 charge which should have been carried out a long time ago.  This is espionage, plain and simple. 

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Danthrax66

Espionage? THIS IS SPARTA!!!

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carage

The Sparta solution would work equally well...oh we need to start digging some wells then...

 

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Danthrax66

Glad to see people with reason on this website still.

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Ghok

Why wasn't there this sort of media circus when Wikileaks posted that footage of the US soliders in Iraq gunning alleged insurgents down? That was much more outrageous than a bunch of things that some crabby diplomats said. I mean, the stuff the US government ADMITS to has done a lot worse than what was recently released. Wikileaks has severally hurt itself here, by posting what is basically gossip, it loses its teeth and people are going to go after it. They got greedy.

I still like that Wikileaks is around, but they have made some bad calls as of late.

The media loves this kind of story because it's about a bunch of crap that doesn't matter. They can get people on both sides to act angry and produce rating grabbing entertainment. That's why that helicopter footage was barely covered. It's the same reason bad politicians love this kind of crap. Leiberman wouldn't have dared go after Wikileaks when they were posting videos of US soldiers happily shooting unarmed people apart, but when they post a bunch of nonsense? Easy pickings.

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LatiosXT

I ran into an article regarding this the other day about how either the Wikileaks founder or one of the higher ups of that website complained that Amazon.com took down their site, backing themselves behind the first amendment (mostly because the government told Amazon.com to take it down). I had some thoughts about this...

1. I'd like Wikileaks to host that controversial book that Amazon.com eventually took down and be proud to host and support the first amendment. They want to hide behind that right like they can say whatever they want? They better be prepared to say anything, no matter how grotesque and wrong the rest of society thinks. (Also Amazon.com took down that book because of pressure from its customers, not the government)

2. I don't know what the case is called, but you're not protected by the first amendment if you yell "FIRE!" in a crowded theater). And I'm sure the leaks are part of that exception.

I like how people think "Freedom of Speech" simply means "I can say whatever the hell I want and the government can't do a thing about it" when the spirit of the right is basically "If I'm disastified with the government, I can make all the complaints I want and they can't do a thing about it."

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Nimrod

your a complete fking idiot. that is all.

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Dman222123222

Says the guy named Nimrod.

xD

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Danthrax66

That is what it should mean. We slowly give up our rights until we have none don't cave to government pressure.

 

And besides this is the truth being revealed not someone yelling fire when there isn't any fire.

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johnny3144

so... truth is bad, right? cause that's what the country representing freedom and liberty is saying right now... or 70%+ of them.

 

 

 

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Danthrax66

Just a reminder this is like what happened in the 70's with the Pentagon Papers: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentagon_Papers

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Danthrax66

You know how the media says this release puts "U.S. ives at risk" well it doesn't. That is just a campaign to block the actual news from the release. Please read more into these documents than what the gov't lets the news report. Don't turn a blind eye to truth because it might anger someone making millions who just got exposed as an scumbag.

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carnivorousslushee23

My biggest problem is that Wikileaks seems to target the U.S. almost exclusively these days.  I know that they have released documents concerning killings in Kenya and other places, but the majority of the high-profile material has all been (negatively) related to the U.S. and its foreign policy.  I see this attitude as malevolent, because the documents they release pertain to events still going on.  The declassification of these documents puts thousands of U.S. and non-U.S. personnel in danger (such as clandestine collaborators in Afghanistan and Iraq who supply us with information about the enemy) - not to mention the fact that they weaken the United States as a whole and threaten to exacerbate conflicts even further than they are already.  Wikileaks is not helping the international stage right now - they're feeding a pending conflict.  Julian Assange is just an asshole Australian hacker who harbors enmity for the U.S. and so attempts to destabilize our foreign relations by releasing information that is best kept secret for the time being (I'm not saying they shouldn't be released at all, just not now, when things are so tense).  His holier-than-thou attitude about "exposing the truth" is just a hunk of bullshit that he hides behind.

Of course, it doesn't help that the President hasn't really done all that much.  He practically just stood there for the last few years while Wikileaks did their thing, and only now has he done anything about it.  In other words, he's a President with no backbone.  "I will be tough!"  My ass.  Bush may have talked like he was dumb, and he may have been wrong about the wars, but at least he had a backbone.  Not so with this fool.  2012 can't come soon enough.

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Danthrax66

Bush ruined this country. Wikileaks is targeting us for 2 reasons 1. we do the most shit around the world for some fucking reason, we should focus on our country not everyone else and 2. we don't have tight enough security on anything.

 

Also we already lost so much respect with a lot of countries that nothing they release can be that damaging to us because we are essentially at the bottom anything further released just empowers the people to make a change and eliminate the corruption and immorality o our government and show the world that we can and will change and become the beacon of freedom we once were. If this information is blocked we may as well burn the constitution because we have no rights and we have fallen under the power of an Oligopoly controlled by the highest bidders.

 

Hopefully people start changing their tune after the release on the banks.

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Keith E. Whisman

Why couldn't Wikileaks leak something actually interesting like the truth behind UFO's, whether UFO's are real or just top secret US spy planes and drones. (I believe UFO's, all of them, are American made)

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Nimrod

yeah because your idiot lights in the sky a hella more impirtant than illegal military mass murder and war on the defenseless right?

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Nimrod

yeah because your idiot lights in the sky a hella more impirtant than illegal military mass murder and war on the defenseless right?

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Danthrax66

The next release has documents with mention of UFOs

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carnivorousslushee23

I would love to find out what exactly the Area 51 facility is used for.  There's too much ambiguity about that place - the fact that I don't know really nags at me for some reason.  Is it really used to store and study alien artifacts?  I wish I knew.

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Keith E. Whisman

Area 51 is a top secret AirForce research and development facility. That should tell you exactly what it is. A lot of veterans and Civilian contractors have been on the History and now military channel telling their stories about how they worked the X15 there. Civilians build top secret aircraft at A-51 with military supervision. So there really isn't much to speculate. To say that aircraft witnessed flying over and parked on the ground at the base are alien is really retarded. I really love it when I hear someone that has zero aviation back ground and says that those lights must be alien.

 

As for Wikileaks. Our soldiers do not commit mass murders. You get into a firefight and try not to shoot civilians but your kinda forced into it when civilians turn themselves into military targets by trying to shield enemy fighters that are shooting at you with their bodies. Of course you have to shoot and kill them all now that they are military targets. They ceased being innocent civilians as soon as they decided to shield the people that are trying to kill you. Fuck them. If you can't stand it then screw you. War is hell and killing is what goes on in war. There is no such thing as a clean war. The only good war is the one that doesn't have to be fought or is quickly over with. If you have to fight a way it should be as bloody and terrible as possible to bring it to a swift conclusion. Make the enemy so afraid to fight that he surrenders en masse like the Iraqi Army did. Be extremely brutal. 

This is why Wikileaks should be shut down. They interfered with US foreign policy, they risked the lives of American secret operatives, and they risked the lives of American citizen soldiers. So go fuck yourself if you think Wikileaks is justified for what they did. You hate America I got that. So go move to fucking China or Moscow, get the freak out of the USA.

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Keith E. Whisman

Hopefully Wikileaks is gone for good. You just don't release military and government secrets like that. They could have sold the documents back to the US government, but nope, they had to be assholes. They don't care who dies because of their need to tell secrets. I say hang em for espionage. 

I fully support all military operations throughout the world because the world is a crazy place. I don't care if this is bad of Obama, (I'm Republican) I do care that we win in our wars and people like those at Wikileaks that try to threaten that aim should be stopped. 

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Nimrod

A congress person was on CNN saying that Wikileaks has "blood on its hands". He reapated this OVER AND OVER untill Wolf Blitzer asked spisifically HOW MANY PEOPLE HAD DIED because of the leaked information.

 

His response.....no one.

 

Point in fact, your a clueless fking moron.

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Danthrax66

Most people in Iraq or Afghanistan don;t have access to wikileaks and don;t speak English so how could it I mean these people just don;t want their jobs on the line so they lie and censor things. "In a free society, we are supposed to know the truth. In a society where truth becomes treason, we are in big trouble."

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/rep-ron-paul-makes-special-request-of-wikileaks-on-foxs-freedom-watch/

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carnivorousslushee23

I agree 100% with your statement.  Wikileaks has no regard for the lives of others.  Their objective is destabilizing and weakening the U.S., plain and simple.  I say hunt and prosecute these assholes into oblivion - maybe they could form a new department at the Pentagon just for that purpose.

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Danthrax66

http://en.rian.ru/world/20101201/161577942.html Shut the fuck up all of you fear-mongering idiots need to quit watching Glen Beck, Sarah Palin, and Fox news. Seriously wake the fuck up our country is getting fucked over by our leaders and the only group with the balls to expose it you ridicule and label terrorists. He wants to ruin the corrupt politicians we have in this country he wants the people to regain power and gain back the respect that America had following WW2 and through the 90's. We can't do this with a country that has leaders spying on the UN and making backroom deals to invade other countries while we know that the country telling us to invade is supplying terrorists. We don't need diplomats that instead of performing their job with dignity perform actions that are an embarrassment to the U.S.

 

But the problem is no one in the U.S. cares about our world view all we care about is Dancing with the stars or Jersey Shore, or *insert trivial bullshit here* Just like these tax cuts they will ruin our country we might as well just start learning Chinese if the tax cuts on the rich would pass because they own us.

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pastorbob

The guy doesn't care one iota about truth or giving the power back to the people. What he wants is his 15 minutes of fame. I think this move by the DNS service is long past due. He stepped over the line a long time ago when he released the names of Afghans who were working with the U.S. forces.

As far as learning Chinese I think it's too late. They already hold most of the notes for our national debt. So let's go ahead and borrow some more so we can extend unemployment benefits and pay for that health care reform (Ha!) as well as all of the other socialist programs that Obama and his progressives want to cram down our throats.

I do agree with you about the priorites of the people in this country being screwed up. It shows in how ignorant most people are of basic math, sciences, history, and geography. I can't believe the things that I consider common knowledge that most people just don't know. And it is worse in the next generation. But boy they sure can text faster than I can. And man can they play the heck out of Wii, Xbox and PS2 games. However ask them a basic Algebra, chemistry or physics question and you get the deer in the headlights stare.

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Danthrax66

So you mean like Medicaid, Medicare, and Social Security? Because those use up most of the National budget because unlike other countries we allow the private sector to control the healthcare and set the cost to astronomical levels $10,000 for a 3 day hospital visit? Drugs that cost hundreds of dollars that are free in Great Britain, France, Italy, etc. Something needs to happen, and honestly if the hole system came crashing down it would be a good thing.

This country has been ran with stupidity for years especially under Bush he was too big of an idiot to realize his tax cuts would ruin this Country I mean even his father realized that taxes couldn't remain cut if we continue to spend.

 

And as for the educational system I think Chemistry, and Physics aren't the right subjects to teach. I mean think about the problems our country faces Economics, Political Science, and History (and not the watered down every American who ever lived was a hero history either actual history that teaches you about how things got fucked up in the past and how we should avoid them). 

 

Hopefully the next release on the banks can really get some change rolling a Country in which the banks control the money is a country doomed for failure. By the way do you know that the Federal Reserve is privately owned? Yeah we are fucked.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHvuXdhnieA

 

It takes someone who isn't afraid of power to make changes, the Anarchists bring down the failed system everyone else needs to build it back up better than before. So I say let this failed version of America crumble so the people can rebuild it learning from the mistakes of our past because as it stands it is impossible to make change.

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carnivorousslushee23

It's all about perspective and opinion, sir.  That's all your comment was, really - opinion.  Allow me to address your statements, then:

#1. Am I supposed to be impressed or reassured by Clinton's statement?  I don't trust Clinton in any remote sense of the word.  This is the woman who wanted socialized medicine in the U.S., the woman who has clung to her husband through the last decade simply because she does not wish to relinquish her political power, and the woman who wants the U.S. to ratify the Kyoto Protocol.  She is as corrupt and deceitful as any politician.

#2. Why do you automatically assume that I listen to/watch Glenn Beck, Sarah Palin, and Fox News? (I love how you singled them out in your comment, by the way - it was highly amusing.)  I'm disappointed that you didn't include Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity in that list, incidentally.  For the record, however, I'll advise you in turn to stop reading/watching the NYT, the Guardian, The Washington Post, CNN, MSNBC, or whatever news outlet you apparently read/watch.  FYI: Sarah Palin makes me extremely uncomfortable, and she doesn't present a very good image for the everyday conservative.  Fox News is obviously not reliable all the time (remember that whole Mass Effect fiasco, for instance?  That was pathetic and completely reactionary, as they are prone to be).  Bill O'Reilly is an opinionated asshole who talks over his "guests" and doesn't allow them to get a word in edgewise.  And also for the record: I do not own a radio, and I do not own a television with cable either.

#3. Jersey Shore and Dancing with the Stars are indeed trivial bullshit.  But please don't assume that I or the majority of Americans care solely about those things; that's just you being presumptuous and, frankly, stupid (See what I did there?  That was an opinion!).  I myself, and my entire family as well, enjoy much of our time reading books.  Who'd've thunk it?  Amurricans are literate!

#4. No government in the entire history of the world has ever taxed itself into prosperity.  The rich are a necessary evil.  We can bitch and cry about them all we want, and generally with good reason, but in the end, we need them.  The jobs that their wealth creates are the jobs that many of us work at every day.  While their motives for creating those jobs (i.e., getting even more money through increased production, etc.) are not exactly as pure as the wind-driven snow, the end result is the same.

#5. Ah yes, of course, the U.S. is the only corrupt and screwed-up country in the world.  Let's not think about Britain, or Greece, or Ireland, or France, or Canada, or Iran, or any of those wonderfully circumstanced countries.  Of course not.  While I heartily acknowledge that our country is corrupt and screwy in many ways, we are far better off than many others.  Of course, with President Obama and his lame-duck Congress still trying to spend us into oblivion via health care, welfare, and the rest of that unfortunately long list, we may end up in the same boat as Greece after all.  Just give it time.

#6. You alternately condemn and advocate censorship in your reply (e.g. "Shut the fuck up all of you fear-mongering idiots need to quit watching Glen Beck, Sarah Palin, and Fox news.") - so which is it?  Because you've got me quite confused here.  Give me some consistency, and I'll attempt to treat your comment with a modicum of the credulity that you seem to believe it warrants.

#7. What solution do you propose for removing/replacing the corrupt politicians and leaders?  Because your statement implies that there is some possibility of a non-corrupt government and Congress.  And if you truly believe that there is, or ever will be, such a thing, then your naivete stretches beyond the bounds I previously thought imaginable.

#8. The U.N. is essentially a huge failure in its current implementation.  A weak, "united" group of nations who essentially censure other countries for committing crimes/etc., but do not back up their words with action.  And a group of nations who attempt to impose policies on member/other nations without regard for the economic impact of said policies (read: The Kyoto Protocol).  The idea of the U.N. is rather nice when you break it down, but it just doesn't work as is.

#9. So you believe that Assange is looking out for the U.S. in the long run?  Because last I looked, the leaks from the U.S. were basically all negative.  Which means that the U.S. is once again diminished in prestige, power, and respect, and nations dislike us even more as well.  All of which bring about a rather unsatisfactory situation for the U.S., in which it is further disliked by the world at large and its relations with allies are marred.  Yes, I quite agree that he has America's best interests at heart.

#10. I could go on ad nauseam, but I'm pretty sure people stopped reading halfway down the page because this post is so frigging long.  And I believe I have proved my point to my satisfaction.  So...

In short, sir, I kindly encourage you to shut the fuck up, as you so charmingly put it.

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Danthrax66

There is a difference in letting idiots talk about non sense and letting the truth flow freely. The UN is weak because we allow them to be weak by trying to be the police of the world ourselves.

 

Oh and healthcare for some reason everyone thinks that socialized health care is bad when there are many countries that have it and have higher quality than us. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialized_medicine#Examples

 

http://healthpolicyandreform.nejm.org/?p=2610 <-- 37th in the world And you know who is ahead of us? Countries that have some form of socialized healthcare. Now I'm assuming you think I like Obama I don't; I don't like 95% of the politicians we have now they are all corrupt and there is too much money in politics. We need someone like Assange to bring up the corruption so we can demand change so we can see how corrupt the people in charge of this country are and have some form of accountability because the thing is we don't elect the diplomats and we need to have some form of check on their activities which we don't have.

And no there is never a way to replace all corruption but term limits on all political seats would help and the ability for the citizens of the U.S. to call into question and investigate politicians and diplomats would help as well. Right now we have a government that governs itself with no accountability other than voting which is also counted by the government and controlled by the government. Hell with electronic voting it is controlled by the company that makes the machines.

 

We should ratify the Kyoto Protocol it would reduce our dependence on foreign oil and improve the environment. America is the only country in the world that doesn't accept that climate change is real there aren't any reputable scientist that say that it isn't happening and we need to do something. But if you also look at it from an economic standpoint it would force new jobs it would force production of greener technologies possibly a redesign of the electrical grid which is needed.

 

As for #4 if the rich were creating jobs we wouldn't be in this mess but they aren't and they are still making money so we have to tax them to offset the lack of new jobs. I'm sure that most media outlets didn't cover what Warren Buffet had to say about taxes but he said that he needs to be taxed more that the millionaires and billionaires of this country have had it better off now than any other group of people in history.

 

Sorry for coming off as a dick but the exposing the truth should never be a crime, just look at the pentagon papers...

 

Everyone is entitled to their opinion but the politicians in this country have for too long put themselves ahead of the people and I'm seeing this as a time for the people to wake up and realize that.  You can't say that something is bad or good unless you research and provide some form of data backing it up. but most people today would rather just make shit up. As for taxes we had 8-10 years of low taxes and all it has done is put us in a deeper hole.

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Danthrax66

you don't get it we aren't at war we haven't been in a war since 1945 we are engaged in police actions to help stabilize countries that had corrupt dictators. The leaks showed that instead of acting as a humanitarian force protecting the people we tortured them as well as the Iraqi police force did. These latest leaks show that we know Saudi Arabia is providing weapons to terrorists that our diplomats are engaged in criminal activity as well as other countries diplomats and in general we should know this. The government is under our control, the people we have a right to know. Wikileaks is doing what the general media should have been doing for the past 30-50 years.

Oh and the bullshit foxnews says about the documents released isn't true, Wikileaks has never endangered lives. Also the news outlets in this country are a joke they don't tell you any of the story except the NY Times.

 

Here some examples: http://www.alternet.org/newsandviews/article/374425/wikileaks_cables_reveal_obama_and_gopers_worked_together_to_kill_bush_torture_probe/?ref=rss

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/dec/02/germany-us-afghan-funds-wikileaks

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2010/dec/03/wikileaks-first-scalp-german-aide

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2010/12/cable-reveals-airstrike-killed-21-children-yemen/

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/dec/02/wikileaks-cables-cia-united-nations

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/29/world/29cables.html?_r=1&scp=2&sq=wikileaks&st=cse

Things we should know. Truth is power and we the people need power to keep our government in check. It isn't espionage, it is protected speech under our constitution. Wikileaks doesn't threaten anything except the end of corruption and the reinstitution of accountability. Oh and we never should have went to war in Iraq and Afghanistan has proved to be a pointless war too 10 years and no Bin Laden, just a bunch of Americans dead. A true American would question why our sons, daughters, significant others are dieing in an illegal war in third world countries.

"In a free society, we are supposed to know the truth. In a society where truth becomes treason, we are in big trouble." -Ron Paul

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I Jedi

**double post: ignore**

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Zachary K.

double post- ignore.

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Zachary K.

we don't need to know everything about government, some things are ok to keep secret. 

it like going into a room and saying "I have aids!" , that would be something that didn't need to be said and will make people uneasy for no reason, unless you were gushing out blood, in which case it would be a good thing to shout out.

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I Jedi

I am a strong supporter in knowing what our governments are doing; however, I think that it is important that governments keep things a secret for a period of time. By a "period of time", I mean the relevance of classified documents to current events. The fact that Wikileaks is continuing to release classified documents endangers the U.S.'s credibility, hurts ties and relationships with other foreign nations, and slows down progress. There was one classified report about Saudi Arabia asking the U.S. to strike Iran's nuclear facilities, which even I was amazed to find out. Yet another classified report talking about the Mexican-drug lord war going on, and how the Mexican government is deeply struggling to maintain its ability to even stay afloat.

Yes, governments should eventually come clean with all their information, but not at the cost of hurting diplomatic ties, and endangering people, such as the proclaimed Afghan/Iraq diaries suggeseted it would. Wikileaks believes in all governments being entirely transparent to their people, and while I can see that point of view, I don't agree that the public should be made aware of everything that is happening at a critical moment in time. To me, its finding a middle ground when documents should be declassified.

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Danthrax66

But they don't, they never do there are documents in this release from 1966. In a government for the people by the people everyone has a right to know.

 

http://bigpeace.com/rehrenfeld/2010/12/01/wikileaks-revelations-and-saudi-arabia-their-oil-is-thicker-than-our-blood/

 

Wikileaks asked the state department to look at the documents and tell them what would risk lives and the state department refused to look at them saying they don't care. If it would have mattered they would have looked at them.

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Ghok

Who is he, Jimbo Wales?

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eric0rr

this was probably DOD, but this just means that DOD has cause to attack switz pirate party, which they have wanted to do for quite a while now

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