Congress Expresses Concern Over E-Mail Surveillance

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sarahmathews

Yes I think it is a breach of security but I don't think there is much we can do about it. Politicians have certain powers and with all the loopholes in our legal system, it doesn't take much to justify a hard breach of Americans' security. Also, the more sophisticated our technology becomes, the more we can be victimized by these advancements. For example: How about the recent updates in home security systems?? Before we didn't have to worry about camera surveillance or alarm systems, but these tools are becoming more and more common as time carries on! We can't go back in time, but we can become knowledgeable on the different technologies that are out there so we won't be subject to a privacy breach!

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Zazubovich

Yet nobody has read the constitution or the declaration of independence?  Nobody can tell the difference between totalitarian and authoritarian governments and republican (small "r", not GOP) democracy?  WTF?  Mattman Bin Laden hates us for our freedoms and our civil rights, guitronic is in some cult conspiracy theory zone, and a few others can feebly defend this country from sloppy sliding into fascism or melting down into libertarian conspiracy cult land?

I hope the fricking ufos are coming in 2012 because I don't think we can survive as a representative democracy when the supposedly smart people don't even know the first thing about our country.  Google up some founding documents, people, and try some Federalist papers too.  Then work your way over to court cases of significance, and maybe, just maybe, you'll be worthy to be an American citizen.  At times like this I wish Americans had to apply for citizenship and go through the process that legal immigrants do so they would appreciate and value what we had and could have again as a nation, after the atrocities of the last eight years.  If you don't know what we had, you can't know what we lost, and you can't value this country's achievements.

Reading all your email?  Hell the NSA guys were net-stalking people with full access.  And when it was found out, the crooked Bush government decided to have it made legal AFTER THE FACT!  That's like me robbing your house, and then when I get busted I have robbery declared legal, just for me, and having it stand up in court.  Yay for me, sux for you!   You can be declared an enemy combatant and disappeared to a gulag without legal recourse, where you will be tortured into making false confessions, beaten, buggered, starved, and isolated, possibly to death.  They are not defending your freedom if they have to take your freedoms away to "defend" them.  That's totalitarianism, whether you prefer the Nazi flavor or the Soviet flavor, the outcome is the same-you'll be trying to find ways to hack around the Happy Filter software like the Chinese do.  

As for the guitronic option, government can't work for the people if it is not allowed to.  Heckuva Job Brownie was intentionally made to faile because the political party he serves is philosophically committed to saying that government can't do anything right, and being proved wrong time and again makes the propaganda pitch hard to sell when it is obvious you're lying.  Medicare works, Social Security works, the military sort of works, and millions of programs do what they are supposed to according to the leadership and bureaucracy that guide them according to Congress and the President's will.  Bush administration officials told Navy and Coast Guard units NOT to rescue people.  The private sector can do that job for twice or three times the money and can profit by hiring alien workers to do the hard jobs for pennies an hour, just like the latest Iraq war, where Cheney is personally making huge amounts of money for doing a job so poorly that more troops die being electrocuted in the showers due to bad construction than have been killed by enemy fire in the same bases.

Obama isn't perfect and he's not even that great but at least he is sincerely trying and not intentionally creating disasters so his buddies can make a fortune off our tax dollars.  And he hasn't decided (that we know of) to kidnap anybody and send them to the anal-rape gulags at Bagram, Gitmo and elsewhere. But right now,thanks to the last eight years of GOP rule, we are less free than any other time since the Alien and Sedition Acts or maybe the World Wars.

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alanmc76

A lot of good points have been made by the participants in this discussion. This is the very essence of the freedoms that were set up by our founding fathers.  I would just like to point out that the individuals that are making the decisions that affect virtually every life on the planet do not have an easy job.  It is impossible to please everyone.

Remember this: they are only human.  They have access to information that we do not, and they make the best decisions they can with that knowledge.  They make mistakes, as would you and I.  We have the luxury of sitting back and watching.  We have the right to second-guess and criticize them, but please respect the offices they hold and were elected to.

If some of you truly want to make a change, then educate yourselves on the issues and write to your senators and congressmen.  That is how you affect change.  Maybe they will listen and maybe they won't, but griping about issues with no knowledge of the facts, no soultions, and no intention of doing anything is nothing more than ignorant whining.

And personally, I am in favor of the NSA, CIA, FBI, and any other three-letter agency, doing whatever they can to keep the bad guys out.  Because they are out there and they would kill you and your family, just because you are a member of Western Civilization.

 

 

-- "What am I, MacGyver? Fix it with what?"--

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Elucidate

I gotta say, i just looked at the pic.  I hope that was a sardonic attempt of NSA type surveillance. Funny!  I bet in reality, there would be one big wall with image recognition software in continuous operation with "eagle eye" at the helm, and one person per monitor.  The general public has no idea what big brother can do (at least I pray that's true), and that is the way it should be.

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Elucidate

I absolutely support the NSA monitoring, not to say all the other agencies we only hear a whisper about once in a blue moon. I agree, if you're not doing anything illegal, no worries. BUT, and this is a big but, I don't trust the intent or use of that privilege. There is an adage, absolute power corrupts absolutely. We have a perfect example: our supreme leader. Transparency? Change? Wha? Firing the Inspector general? Please. Maybe the NSA should make people feel better and say the taps and so forth are done double blind. That way, the misuse of said information becomes very difficult to happen. It would be inefficient (maybe unacceptably so), but none the less your privacy is maintained as long as you're legal.

It truly is sad that we must rule ourcountry to the lowest common denominator.

If you liked the Elegant Universe by Brian Greene, you'll love the Endless Universe- Beyond the big bang theory by Paul Steinhardt and Neil Turok.

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ironhammers

@Tekzel

(yet, hell, maybe he will fix Bush's mistakes, but I doubt it)

 BUSH=OBAMA, all the same my friend, they are just doing what they are told!

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moneyfairy

So the gov. can read are email, tap are phones, and pritty much watch are every move. Where the gov. gets to keep just about everything they do a secret.. seems pritty fair to me.. especially since people in the gov. are so darn honest, they would never steal a dime of tax payer money, and they would definitly NEVER use there power for there own gain....

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AndyYankee17

there's going to be virtually no reaction because obama's president, if bush was president though, there'd be riots in the streets

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Tekzel

Please, I am no Obama fan (yet, hell, maybe he will fix Bush's mistakes, but I doubt it), but people didn't riot in the streets with all the damage Bush blatantly did to the constitution.  He might as well have burned the thing.

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mattman059

If you're not doing anything illegal in the first place..who cares?

NSA..you have my permission to read my emails.

Seriously people...stop being such idiots.

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Vegan

Why does mattman hate freedom?

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mattman059

mattman doesnt hate freedom
mattman likes freedom which is why he doesnt mind the gov't protecting his freedom by monitoring emails/phones

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Digital-Storm

So. My email is my email. If the government has to read everyones email, then they think everyone is a criminal.

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Tekzel

That is a ridiculous statement.  How about let the government put cameras in your bathroom and bedroom as well, after all you aren't doing anything illegal, so who cares right?  Bush and his cronies overstepped their bounds HUGELY with absolutely un-constitutional legislation like the PATRIOT Act.

Heres to hoping the people who run this country remember what values it was actually founded on soon.

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mattman059

I love the fact that you are comparing your phone conversations, and email with what you choose to do in a bedroom or bathroom. If you can't see the difference there then you are  beyond help. Now im not saying i agree with every thing either bush or obama is doing in terms of legislation but I am saying that they have the right and the responsibility to protect americans by whatever means necessary. If you don't think that reading a few emails and wiretapping a few conversations is legitamately justified then it might be time for you to look to getting a passport and leaving.

oh. and exactly what were the values the country was founded on? how about:
Treason and Anarchy to name a couple?

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nekollx

 Ever hear of Phone Sex?

Cybering?

 How is that different from what you do in the bedroom?

 

If they are not alowed to watch me fuck my wife why are they aloud to heard me fuck a phone whore or cyber with my wife over gmail?

------------------------------
Coming soon to Lulu.com --Tokusatsu Heroes--
Five teenagers, one alien ghost, a robot, and the fate of the world.

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guitronics

 I am gravely disappointed in the Government of the USA. They have nothing else to do but screw with Citizen's  Rights. I say: have the smallest possible Government: just enough to prevent anarchy.S.O.P. is to create vast numbers of redundant departments to increase the size and scope of "the Parasite".

 Example: G.W.Bush get's elected as a "Conservative". He's supposed to CONSERVE the resources of this nation. Terrorist acts happen, and he finds out that the FBI and CIA aren't communicating, and aren't sharing intelligence. Instead of forcing them to re-vamp operations and cooperate, he creates yet another Department : "Homeland Security".    

 Americans - do you feel more secure now?

 Hurricane Katrina - FEMA was shown to be worse than useless, people could not leave New Orleans without permission. Permission was not granted for weeks.Folks trying to leave by walking were ordered back....people in vehicles, the same....by the National Guard.  POLICE STATE Tactics.

 The local Police, State Police, and Feds confiscated people's legally - owned firearms. 2nd amendment rights trampled, by the government. Take away the legal power of the people to defend themselves - That is Criminal.

They waste our money, start bullshit wars (Osama Bin Laden is the culprit, so our armed forces go after Saddam Hussain and Iraq ?), and squander the energies of the people. This Government is totally out of control. They give our money to other countries, fund the Anti - USA United Nations , and trample our rights.They actually give tax breaks to companies who outsource...and show them how to do so.Yes,there's a department for that,also.

 I couldn't believe it when the Supreme Court voted to allow contractor's to use "Eminent Domain" to evict East coast people from their humble homes, some of which had been in their families' for generations; because the local government would get more tax money from the new, expensive homes that would be put up.     Way to go.

 The Constitution (Which every office holder at the Federal level is sworn to uphold) was created to "Bind down the power of government as if with chains" to ensure the rights of it's citizens. The government of the USA does not respect the Constitution, they do as they damn well please.

 The internet is a most wonderful thing....the actual manifestation of free speech. 

 They  want to monitor, control, tax,police,and restrict this medium. They don't give a damn about the Constitution. The Federal Government, most State Governments,County Governments, City Governments;and their cronies' in big business want to manipulate and control the people.

 We need less government!  Vote out the ones that don't do their job(s) according to the Constitution.

 Our government is THE biggest threat to freedom that exists.

 Isn't that ironic? 

 I love my country, I fear it's government.

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yr

I fail to see your equation mattman.

1) can the govt just open your mail or search your house without a warrant? Why should email or telephone monitoring be any different. Legally it IS EXACTLY THE SAME, or at least it was. Ever heard of the US Constitution; the part about "search and seizure". How do you define "search"? Google it if your not sure.

2) Why is spying on me in my house any different? Either way, the law is that what I do in my house is not for the govt to see for my protection. It is irrelevant what I am doing. The law protects criminals against the govt until they are proven guilty. Which leads to ...

3) If an agency deems someone a threat, get a warrant and snoop legally. There are ways that the govt can find out about things legally without breaking the law, and then use the law to extract justice. Remember "guilty until proven innocent"?

4)  The govt was not founded on treason. The US broke off of Brittian and the Founding Fathers gave 'unalienable rights" to everyone. They also hung traitors, but not before they were allowed to stand trial, and proof had to be brought infront of the judges to prove guilt. 

The govt was not given omnipotent power. They have to learn to use what they have to do their jobs, not change the rules to fit their conveniences.

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mattman059

technically, and this is quite technical, the gov't can do whatever they want with my mail seeing as it's federal property until I recieve it.

If you paid attention in govt class then you would know that during times of global instability (which i dare anyone to say that there is no instability, and mean it) the powers of the govt increase to secure the country. I see absolutely no problem with them listening to my phone call or reading my emails (and i honestly dont care what im talking about...if they're interested, be my guest)

regardless of what side of the argument you're on...be sure of this:

The governmet can and will do whatever they want.
if there is a lawsuit over this, big deal...their computers will be up and running by 9AM EST tomorrow. Guarenteed.
Try and stop them :)

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